Falun Gong Tried to Celebrate Sichuan Earthquake But Got Boo’ed

May 17th – When the tragedy of Sichuan earthquake saddens millions of people all around the globe, Falun Gong New York branch held a party in Flushing, NY this afternoon to celebrate the hit to China – Chinese people and government alike. Featured with balloons, music, speeches, and posters that read “Bad Karma for China”, the event was apparently intended to be joyful, but it quickly got frowned upon. Local residents doing weekend shopping were angered by the farce. They spontaneously gathered around the block and started protesting the event. “NYPD didn’t allow us (to gather) at first, because those (Falun Gong) scums had got an approved permit. But eventually they just let us get by. A cop even gave us a thumb up.”, a person witnessed the event said.

The Sichuan earthquake is the biggest natural disaster in 30 years in China, and has taken at least 29,000 lives. The final death toll is estimated at more than 50,000. Chinese people are deeply concerned by this disaster, while the government is making unprecedented effort to send relief force.

Falun Gong is a semi-religious group that got its principles from Buddhism and ancient Chinese qigong. Chinese government announced it a cult and banned it in 1999. Falun Gong has since headquartered in the U.S. and got financial support from the U.S. National Endowment for Democracy, an extension fund of CIA. Third-party view found Falun Gong “includes rejection of science and promise of supernatural powers” and “a movement which does not accept criticism”.

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204 Comments

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204 responses to “Falun Gong Tried to Celebrate Sichuan Earthquake But Got Boo’ed

  1. Love China! Sopport China! Love and support you guys (Thanks for this article)!

    • FalunGong is BULLshit

      all this falun gong is bullshit. I have nothing to say to these degenerates that taiwan and other anti chinese groups have said in the recent situations. It is despicable to consider these people to be from the chinese bloodline. Many of them should stay in the United States because it is the only country in the world that tolerates this kind of free speech which is perfectly fine but the fact is to celebrate the death of others who died in Sichuan is disgusting. That’s final and my final point is falun gong is bullshit.

    • Falun Gong are Extremist and a Cult

  2. Specul8r

    Now you can see how those Falun Gong’s true nature is. They put on the label “Truth, Compassion, Patience” as a label to fool everyone and when time to show compassion to Sichuan earthquake victim, they were condemning them and even dare to say it’s the “bad karma”.

    So folks… are you still going to belief Falun Gong or should we say “Falun Gone”. Well, it’s going to be gone away in two years when people wake up from the nightmare controlled by the evil man dressed in fake buddha suit.

  3. Cindy6

    FLG is just a silly cult. They are still around ’cause they still have funding from the likes of NED. They need publicity to keep the money rolling.

  4. bio99

    This is communist propaganda. Anyone who wants to find out the truth about Falun Gong and the terrible persecution inside China can do so. Falun Gong was very popular for many years, 70 million people were practicing it. CCP propaganda makes people change their minds. You should all think for yourselves and look at the facts for yourselves. People should not be killed for believing in Falun Gong, and you should not support a brutal regime that persecutes people. China is not the Chinese Communist Party. Falun Gong is just a peaceful qigong practice. Wake up people.

    • FalunGong is BULLshit

      lol you seem to be completely one sided and blinded too by your views. The fact that if you are a peaceful qigong practice why are you aiming for your anti-communist propaganda movements? By the way you have no right to defend a pathetic organization that celebrates the death of so many is Sichuan. Shame on you and go fu*k yourself please.

  5. bio99

    Also, go read this: “A Communist-Made Disaster” http://www2.nysun.com/opinion/communist-made-disaster/76569/

    Everyone should feel sorry for the victims of the terrible earthquake–that is not in question. But when something like this happens and extra harm is caused by the CCP’s corruption, you should speak out against that. That’s true patriotism.

  6. Dana Churchill

    Falun Gong is a very peaceful meditation practice. We have been thanked by the secret service for our peacefulness at many political meetings and rallies where there were many Senators and Congress Members… I work directly with Washington DC speaking to the Reps and Senators, they all know the plight of Falun Gong in China. This article above is CCP propaganda. I personally know many of the Falun Gong practitioners at the Quit the CCP rally in Flushing and it was not a celebration at all, nor did it condemn or have any joyousness for anyone’s bad plight. We actually had a meeting last night trying to find ways to help the earthquake survivors, but did not know what to do bec the CCP has pocketed over 9 billion yen so far from earthquake donors and we wanted to find a way to give money directly to the towns and people who suffered the terrible devastation.

    Anyone can post anything on the Web so find out all the facts before you launch into a fervent tirade that endangers others and tramples on human rights. This is America and there are laws here and due process of law. Unlike in China where the CCP thugs control by terrorismm and try to control here doing the same thing. Please think about this.

  7. Jan

    This is not an objective report. According to my experience Falun Gong people did show concern to the earthquake and they pointed out that the death toll was so high is to a great extend a consequence of the slow reaction from the communist government of China. For example, first after more than 30 hours the first 1000 soldiers arrived to epicenter. Only 20 helicopter were sent to the epicenter area. China with its economic strength could have sent 200000 soldiers and 100 helicopters. For the communist party, power security is more important than saving life. It is typical with all communist regime to ly in every possible way in order to make people to believe that they are the heros and the dissidents, in this case FLG, the trouble makers. The facts show it is just the other way round!

  8. Alessandro

    Ahahaha…why not 2.000.000 soldiers and 1000 helicopters? Or 4.000.000 soldiers and 2000 helicopters?? It’s so funny when people open their mouth just to let their teeth take some sunlight…How much better would it be if they could first switch-on their brains.
    China reaction to the earthquake aftermath (though not perfect, cause in such accident there’s always space and hope for doing more) has been praised by UN General Secretary and other institutions, and have surprised many people for the speed and professionalism that have been displayed.
    It’s so sad when someone has to necessarily go against something at all costs, no matter what…

  9. Xaver

    They obviously chose a wrong place and wrong time to lodge their anger at communist party.

    And all this time, they have done nothing to help with China’s development . The only thing I see them doing is trying demonising China at their best.

    They used to boast of 70 million practicers in China, now how many are left there? Would you say China killed all these 70 million ppl right under the watch of your financial funder CIA?

    I wonder why behind every anti-china group CIA is found. So is it with Dalai Lama, so is it with FLG.

  10. bio99

    That’s nonsense. It’s well known that so many deaths of children were caused by the poor construction and corruption of the CCP. It doesn’t take a stretch of the imagination. If you just refuse to look at the objective circumstances that will be your fault. Falun Gong is not even angry at the communist party. These thugs are persecuting innocent people for their beliefs and they should stop it, but Falun Gong practitioners only want other Chinese people to see the CCP for what it is. This is not demonising China. The CCP is not China. Over 3000 Falun Gong practitioners are known to have been tortured to death; this means that there are often photos and several eye witness evidences. Tens of thousands are suspected to have been killed for their organs to sell to foreigners. Do you think this is okay?

    善有善報惡有惡報

  11. Alessandro

    Excuse me bio99, are u saying that in other countries this wouldn’t have happened? Are saying that with earthquakes of that magnitude (8° on the richter scale…always try to remember!) schools in other countries would have stood up and not crumbled? Well, it didn’t happen so in Italy, were many schools crumbled in the last strong earthquake some years ago, and also happened in many many other “advanced” countries. Think before u speak, please. Was it the CCP to cause the earthquake? Was it the CCP itself to build the schools or were them built by PEOPLE like me and you, who, for sure, tried to save money for themselves and probably used low quality materials? And this happens and happened only in China, with the EVIL (as u seem to suggest every single time) CCP or also in countries all over the world? Is corruption only a China plague or does it exists in every other place in the world (including our “freedom champions” in the US)???
    Come on…try for once to see beyond your own hatred, just for one time and try to be objective.
    For sure some people and some company have acted criminally in using low quality materials for schools, and also some functionary have not made the anti-seismic laws for building respected, both for negligence or for criminal money interests…and those people must be found out and persecuted according to the law. But things like these happen everywhere, in so many countries in the world. So please try to be a little less biased and a little little more objective.

    Alessandro

  12. falun gong is evil

    Any human being with a tiny heart would not celebrate this natural disaster. Even during war time the two sides may cease fire under certain circumstances. The celebration by the Falun Gong is simply evil and inhuman and so Falun Gong. They even got legal permit in advance to prepare this party. What a bunch of scums.

  13. Anonymous

    It’s no secret that flimsy materials were used in the construction of many buildings in the poor rural areas. Ideally, the government should have placed their first priority on improving the infrastructure in the poorest regions of China instead of focusing money and energy on the Olympics and racing to build ultra-modern buildings in the cities. That being said, a well-constructed buildings would barely survived an 8 point earthquake or withstood the force of a mountain collapse. Even the ‘karma’ of the Falun Gong could not have prevented such massive destruction.
    Rather than happily nitpicking everything about the rescue operation, FG needs to show more compassion and understanding about the tremendous difficulties brave rescuers face in this operation and appreciate the relatively quick reaction by the government in dispatching help. You couldn’t say that about George Bush during Katrina.

  14. xjl

    Some comments above make me feel the urge to tell some of my personal experience with Falun Gong. In 1998 when I was still in college and Falun Gong was at its peak and still legal, my TA, a graduate student invited about 10 people in my class, including me, to dinner, and gave us a book, the famous “Spinning Falun”, 1st edition. He was a practitioner. Since he was a nice guy, we promised we would read it and brought it to dorm. It was circulated, we all read it, and the unanimous conclusion was: it was a lousy book with tons of absurdities. There are some things barely acceptable, such as “a spinning falun (or wheel) at your abdomen”, “everything unlucky you face is the devil coming to prevent your practice”, given that Falun Gong was using a lot of Qigong and Buddhism stuff (as said in this blog post). But things like “the master (Li Hongzhi) is the incarnated Buddha”, “master is fighting devil in the outer space”, and the famous line “light year is a lot more magnitude of time (instead of length) ” were just beyond our tolerance threshold. We passed the book to every single student in our dorms and it gave us a good laugh, for what it’s worth. None of us liked it, and every student suddenly realized why the TA always looked a little strange, or somehow “nerdy”.

    During summer vacation my mom suddenly mentioned Falun Gong to me and asked me how I thought about it. I told her the story and she told me the reason she asked was that a neighbor of us started practicing. The neighbor, a lady in her late 30’s, used to be a kind person and she had a pair of beautiful twin children. Now she kept telling my mom the twins were 业障, roughly translates to debt one owned in previous lives. She said the children came in this life to get paid back, and they are another sort of constraints that prevent a FLG follower from succeeding the practice. I met the twins later, they tried to avoid mentioning anything about their mother. The family, from what I saw, was breaking apart.

    Then the next year an article criticizing FLG was published in Tianjin, the city I was in. FLG followers flooded the newspaper agency that published it, protesting and trying to stop the paper’s business. Weeks later thousands of Falun Gongers blocked roads to the central government to protest yet again. FLG got banned, as everybody knows.

    As for the TA, he stopped practicing, and later he graduated and had a good job, and a nice wife. My mom’s neighbor also stopped it. Although her children still showed a little uneasy when I saw them with their mother, in early 2000.

  15. Thomas J. Hillgardner

    Qigong is a marvelous practice; Falun Gong is an organization. Some say a cult. But cult is just a perjorative term used to discredit small organizations. Still, there is some truth on both sides of the Falun Gong issue. There is no doubt that the CCP persecutes practitioners. There is also no doubt that the leadership of the Falun Gong movement threatened the CCP’s hold on power in China and became “too big for its britches.” In America, we think that governments that crack down on political and religious organizations are terrible. But the reality is that there are numerous governments that do so and the CIA and strong anti-Communist forces in America unfairly single out China for treating oppositionist poorly. Should peaceful practitioners of Falun Gong in China be jailed? Of course not. Is that what is really going on in China? Probably not. Only the practictioners that support the power of the Falun Gong leadership over the power of the CCP are jailed.

    Finally, I live in Jamaica, New York, about two miles from the Flushing library where the protest took place and this report originated. I can absolutely confirm that the Falun Gong practitioners were gleeful about the earthquake. It was a pretty stupid thing for the FG to do. There were lots of angry people in the streets; angry at the Falun Gong for kicking China when its down. Who can blame them. It was a boneheaded thing to do.

    • Antony Clark

      I’m sorry to hear that you actually witnessed the ‘celebration’ of the Sichuan earthquake. I had assumed that such a disgraceful thing could only be propaganga.
      But don’t imagine that if you can peacefully practice FG activities in China. You would be considered mad, and at the very least lose your job and any hope of future employment. You would eek out a living, perhaps, extracting recycables from rubbish bins.

      • terminator

        No you don’t have to live like this. You just pretend being politically prosecuted by the Chinese government and fabricate all sorts of scaring stories. Then suddenly, you will be granted greencard, get funding from NED, and live in US happily after.

  16. Pug

    The whole organ harvesting thing is false.

    http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2006/April/20060416141157uhyggep0.5443231.html

    According to the US Dept of State, they do not find any conclusion that China has harvested any organs.

    There’s a big difference between doing qigong and being a following the beliefs falun gong.

  17. jntikitembo

    What they did in Flushing is totally despicable. It was also completely pointless. It If anything it undermines the goodwill “westerners” have given them in the past. Now know-nothings like me are starting to learn and understand how ridiculous this organization is.

    Note that I don’t really give a damn about the CCP or the political aspects of things. In my opinion any government that can bring about prosperity for its people is a good government.

    Bio99, tell your people to go preach and practice your “religion” privately please.

  18. physicall

    The Falun Gong newspaper has reported on this as well…in a decidedly different light.

    http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-19/70828.html

    This claims that the CCP “organized mobs” to attack “peaceful” protesters for “withdrawing from the CCP”

  19. falun gong is evil

    The FLGs realized that their celebration on the earthquake won’t gain sympathy from public but only be frowned upon from all around the world. So they shifted the pose to withdrawing from ccp and claiming the protestors were organized by ccp. All these bs were not surprising at all. That’s all similar to what they did in the past. I had extensive contacts with a few FLGs. They were normal and even nice people in regular time while no FLG contents were involved. That’s one of the reason that they, or the FLG, have been accepted in the worlds outside of mainland China. But when it came to FLG, these people’s absurdity and stupidity are simply beyond my comprehension and imagination. Of the ones I knew they all hold master and Ph. D degree or at least a bachelor’s degree. I could only gave up after I had argued them so many times because their brains were completely preoccupied by nothing but the doctrins of Li Hongzhi whenever we discussed FLG. Once we stopped to talk something else they were as normal and mart as they used to be. That’s so amazing. FLG had long before claimed that Li Hongzhi prophesied that colossal catastrophes will happen, particularly in China, and that’s the judgment day, the doomsday. The way to escape it is to practice Falun Dafa and denounce the CCP. They even said it still works if you denounce and withdraw the CCP anonymously. Now the earthquake happened and they believe what Li Hongzhi said is proved. That’s why they came out to celebrate (actually they are out 365 days a year. You can see them any day in time Square and on Wall Street).

    I’d say that a lot, if not most, of Li Hongzhi’s followers are normal people while the Falun Gong is not involved. But once the FLG bullshit gets in they are almost completely different people. They worship Li Hongzhi like a living God. In most their gatherings Li Hongzhi does not even to be present.

    However, their act to celebrate the earthquake is evil. It make them look like human garbage.

    In my opinion Li Hongzhi is an evil bastard.

  20. I do think there are a lot of problems in CCP political system. However, we should see CCP is changing and getting better.They are doing a great job on saving people’s lives in Sichuan earthquarke.

    I have been to China so many times and I love the country. I have the faith on Chinese people, not on Falungong scrubs. Celebrate on death? WTF?

    Paul
    Sydney

  21. Pingback: Some rabid Falun Gong followers show their ugly side in Flushing, NY | We mourn the victims of Sichuan earthquake. China shall overcome!

  22. yw214

    anti-human being, what they did before in China, what they are doing now in America, what they are going to do in the future around the world.

    God, please forgive these FLG scums, they are just animals.

  23. Christopher

    I wonder if the FLGers here like Bio99 could show us a single claim/report made by FLG or its “media” to be true;

    I wonder if the FLGers here like Bio99 could show us any proof that the FLG leadership has shown any “compassion” to any people outside of the cult itself (which we won’t be able to confirm);

    I wonder why the FLGers are always full of hatred, and bitter.

  24. Anonymous

    This article seems very suspect. There don’t seem to be any reliable reports of this event, including this article.

  25. phy

    To the above anonymous, if you can speak Chinese, there are plenty of reliable reports around, since you can simply listen to what average people said on the streets right at that time. There are quite a few video clips showing those things. But if you don’t speak Chinese, then I’m sorry, I guess you just have to believe me that this article is very objective, as far as I can tell from peoples’ reactions shown in those video clips. As for the claim that those people are organized by CCP, that’s just BS. Again, if you speak Chinese, that’s too easy to spot. In fact, as far as I can tell, never has CCP been able to “organize” anything in US, unless people voluntarily support them.

  26. specul8r

    So Bio99, explain this with your subjective view:

    You said “It’s well known that so many deaths of children were caused by the poor construction and corruption of the CCP. It doesn’t take a stretch of the imagination. If you just refuse to look at the objective circumstances that will be your fault.”

    How can you make your building to withstand 8.0 earthquake near the epicenter in a populated region and hoping to have less casuality? You and all falun gone group are just trying to blame everything on CCP without reasonable logic.

    Also, since the first day of earthquake, I have checked clearwisdom.net, epochtimes.com, NTDTV.com, and many falun gone affiliate websites and there’s no single reference to encourage Sichuan Earthquake Relief donation drive. Why? It’s not falun gone’s problem and it’s the problem of CCP? Any human beings who have sympathetic feelings toward another human beings that are suffering will and generate compassion to help but apparently all these falun gone people are already reached the god status and don’t need to have these compassions any more. Then, why does god care about CCP?

    If any of you interested how falun gone has started, see for yourself at youtube. These videos are in Chinese and if you don’t understand, find someone to translate for you.
    http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=+%E6%B3%95%E8%BD%AE%E5%8A%9F%E6%98%AF%E5%A6%82%E4%BD%95%E8%B5%B7%E5%AE%B6%E7%9A%84%E5%A4%A7%E8%B5%B7%E5%BA%95&search_type=

    Here are some more videos made available by the same person on youtube.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/iop8567

  27. specul8r

    Here’s the actual video from all normal chinese people booing falun gone’s insensistive devilish celebration

  28. specul8r

    more video to expose all these inhumane falun gone’s devilish celebration

  29. specul8r

    To Dana Churchill

    You said “I personally know many of the Falun Gong practitioners at the Quit the CCP rally in Flushing and it was not a celebration at all, nor did it condemn or have any joyousness for anyone’s bad plight.”

    Watch this video about “quitting the Communist Party” and you will laugh when you know about the truth. (Chinese language video)

    “We actually had a meeting last night trying to find ways to help the earthquake survivors, but did not know what to do bec the CCP has pocketed over 9 billion yen so far from earthquake donors and we wanted to find a way to give money directly to the towns and people who suffered the terrible devastation.”

    do you have any proof or you read Falun Gone propaganda? Even Taiwanese “Tzu-Chi foundation” is helping to collect donations for the benefit of those suffering in China.

    “Anyone can post anything on the Web so find out all the facts before you launch into a fervent tirade that endangers others and tramples on human rights. This is America and there are laws here and due process of law. Unlike in China where the CCP thugs control by terrorismm and try to control here doing the same thing. Please think about this.”

    China also has law to protect it’s citizens. When Falun Gone people are blocking universities and Tiananman square by sitting in protests during the day time (instead of doing productive work), they are hampering normal business activities. Aren’t they breaking the law? Did they get permit to protest before they show up like they do here in U.S.? If you want to compare apple to apple, you better make sure you have the same apple type.

  30. specul8r

    Sujiatun bluff accusation by Falun Gone is rebuffed in this video:

  31. falun gong is evil

    Is this site also operated by Falun Gong? Highly likely. They were posting bold blatant lies. So sick and tired of dealing with these FLG liars and scums. They are like the disgusting fungus on the toenail.

    For Li Hongzhi he will enjoy the his evil fame and god status among his followers and financial support from various sources. Good for him if he wants it.

    For his ordinary followers, I hope they will end in one of the two ways: they either reach the so called higher level promised by Li Hongzhi, or wake up and say “fuck, what I have done with all these Falun Gong bullshit” before they die. If they end in anything in between I’d say they wasted their entire life with Li Hongzhi.

    Plus if you feel gleeful on an earth quake and 55000 plus death of civilians you are 100% evil. Wake up.

    For non-Chinese readers, if you do not have deep knowledge of China or can’t use Chinese language fluently it may be very hard to know all these, CCP, CIA, FLG, Li Hongzhi, his followers, and those people protesting FLG’s celebration on earthquake.

    http://chinaview.wordpress.com/

  32. specul8r

    Read about how deceitful falun gone people try to manipulate the chinese community. in this article “Ties to Falun Gong add controversy to the Chinese New Year Spectacular”

    source:
    http://articles.latimes.com/2008/jan/07/entertainment/et-chinese7

    This is another way how Li Hongzhi sucks those artists/musicians/dancers and make money out of them without their knowledge besides selling those books until the Chinese shutdown the press and burned all these books that he once owned in China. That’s why he is against Chinese government with vengeance that he can no longer enjoy the free money he once received from selling the books. So, he invented the idea to make the Chinese Spectacular and blasting China about destroying the 5000 years old Chinese Culture. If you have been to China, China has been modernizing as well as preserving the old traditional culture and it’s not as what you want to believe from reading from falun gone group propaganda. I know because I am not from China but I have been to China to see their tradional culture dance is still available as of today. You might wonder, if the traditional culture was destroyed by CCP, how do these falun gone members can perform the way they are? Isn’t there’s something wrong with their claim?

  33. Han Ren

    specul8r, i wonder if you actually work for the chinese government, because you certainly sound like you got a vengence against FLG.

    before I get accused like bio99 did, I shall declare that I do not practice FLG, nor associate with anyone that is part of FLG, I am simply a neutural person who believes FLG is just like any other religion, its followers are simply eligious.

    now to your comments:

    1 “Watch this video about “quitting the Communist Party” and you will laugh when you know about the truth. (Chinese language video)

    firstly the authentiticity of the quotes and screenshots featured in this CCP made anti-FLG video, is highly questionable, secondly even if they were all true, last part of it would have been intentionally comical, as having modern non-mainland chinese celebrities included in the withdraw list as well as Chairman Mao himself.

    2, for the video showing protest in Flushing. where CCP claims FLG went to disrupt donation for sichuan.

    how odd is that the supposed “donation for sichuan disaster” has not a single sign or organisor shown in that video? and how odd is that the only signs, a truck loads of them, happen to anti-CCP signs by the Withdraw-CCP Group? because it is clearly not a Sichuan donation related event.

    And most interstingly, Why is that so convenient the reporter and her crew that just happen to be there, are actually from a Mainland chinese TV channel – the Chang Chuan TV Channel? you wouldnt think the whole was pre-orgnised, would you?

    3, for the videos you quoted regarding the TianAnMen burning suicides, can you for one stop referencing CCP made martirials and check what the rest of the world think in Wikipedia please? and look at the ZhuanFaLun book to see where did it ever say one should burn himself to death? in fact why dont you read the part where it actually says about killing and suicide.

    4, on Lihongzhi and his income from books.

    I found it funny you have such a hatred towards him having some income from there, you use the word “evil” a lot, hmm… is JK Rowling “evil” for making money from Harry Potter books? i think not, and she has made roughly 1 million times more money from Harry Potter than Li ever made him ZhuanFaLun.

    point being, Li is a religious leader, he writes a book and people buys it, there is nothing legally or morally wrong with that, what is wrong is exactly what you later mentioned, CCP burns them. I ask how many books has got burned by modern governments in the last 50 years? let a lone a book not abotu bombing or hate?

    sure, Li got richer than some from what he had been doing, but are you going to accuse all religious leaders who live a comfortable life? what about Dalai?, what about the Pope?

    5, on the subject of distructed schools killing children.

    In Japan, where earth quake happens often, what people do is run to schools in event of earth quake, because schools suppose to be build stronger and more earth quake resistant than any buildings. a chinese warlord in early 1900s said “If a local governer’s office stood better than a school in even of earth quake, the the local governer needs to be shot”

    Yet in this earth quake, schools the the only buildings that had all colipised, surrounding buildings, even the ones that were classified as “High Risk” did not fall.

    now some may say it is the lack of fund from central goverment (which should never be an excuse anyway) and forced compulsery 9 year education system, but ever since early 1980s, there has been a thing called XiWang GongCheng, which stands for Hope Project, that had been recieving billions of donations from the general population for one sole purpose – building schools. so any developing country can cry for lack of funds, but not china. where have this huge amount of money gone? maybe paying people like youself to spread the hate towards anti-CCP groups, such as FLG and possible Tibet.

  34. Han Ren

    xjl,

    you, I can write similar stories abotu 1000 more people’s not-so-favourable experience with Christianity, and you that would matter whether Christianity deserve its popularity or not?

    what you and your neighbor thinks of FLG does not matter, not even the slightest. I too have read the book and I too dont much of it, but the simple fact is that millions of people believed into it, thus it became a religion.

    i dont think that much of The Bible either, and I am sure if I read the Karan I wouldnt think it has the greater truth and wisdom either, but that doesnt mean Christianity and Islam dont have a good reason to be dominating the world of religions.

  35. Han Ren

    on the subject itself.

    CCP insist that FLG was “celerating the earth quake”, and FLG calls it bad karma, and some people would just start believing it. why dont you go to FLG’s official site and see it for yourself on what is their actual position on the matter?

    what FLG is trying to say is that the scale of damage is only so huge because CCP’s ignorance in poor school building construction and non-action to earlier predictive reports about this earth quake, even National Geographic had published warnings 10 month ago.

  36. Alessandro

    Han Ren about schools…..

    just a stupid question…are u comparing seismicity in Japan and in Sichuan???
    Japan is without any doubt one of the most seismic country in the world, with tens of active volcanoes, and stands exactly on what geologists call the “Pacific ring of fire”, which arguably is the most seismic active and dangerous place in the entire world..it’s just normal that in such a place schools and other structures are built according to very strict anti-seismic laws.
    Sichuan, as many other parts of the world which are more or less seismic, is not anywhere near that level of seismicity, it’s completely another league. Name me another country in the world, except Japan for the reasons given and economy, in which schools are purposedly and sistematically built to withstand a Richter scale 8th magnitude earthquake (if such a building exists at all…don’t think there can be any absolute guarantee that a building could withstand an earthquake of such magnitude)…Not any in the countries in Europe, not Australia, not even US (with maybe the exception of California, near S. Andreas Fault)..which should be the richest country in the world (no, they’re too busy spending for their military instead)..If, god forbids, such an earthquake should happen in one of these countries, i strongly doubt that schools built there would withstand it much better that Sichuan’s.
    Criminal behaviour, corruption and superficiality in building industry exists wherever in the world, and no government even in the so called “advanced world” has yet been able to fully address such problems, if ever one really tried, so please don’t use a natural disaster that killed tens of thousands of people for whatsoever political attack or political stances.
    If law-breaking and corruption happened, and it surely did, it should be legally prosecuted and dealt with…and we can all hope that this event will serve as a warning for the future to be more careful and more strict in enhacting anti-seismic laws..but to mount an instrumental and political controversy on that is useless and, forgive me, easy and superficial.

    For FLG, i don’t really know it well, but the simple fact, as u seem to directly imply in ur post, that someone uses different philosophic and spiritual sources to build and sell a book, and eventually the book actually sells, doesn’t automatically and directly make it a religion (and I, for one, still fail to understand the common opinion that considers religions as somewhat intrinsically positive by themselves, that automatically deserves respect and protection…). If that was the case, so many writers, philosophers and blatant charlatans whose books sold in the millions, should be considered as religious leaders. And what makes a religion automatically worth of respect, regardless of its contents and teachings?

  37. Alessandro

    As for predicting earthquake..have we left our objectivity and our brain out of the door today?….Even the freshest student out of a Geology Faculty will confirm u that actual forecast of an earthquake is, still for the moment, IMPOSSIBLE….the rest are only instrumental arguments used pro or against something. Moving millions of people just on the mere statistic possibility (because we’re simply talking of statistic calculations here) there’ll be an earthquake somewhere is practically and easily understandable UNDOABLE for any country.
    Even if FLG followers were protesting for that…they whouldn’t have been any less idiotic.
    We can only hope that our scientific ability to really predict earthquake will beacome more consistent early in the future.

  38. phy

    To Han Ren, one thing is sufficient to show your bias. Whoever that’s discussing the issue here, he/she is NOT CCP. CCP is NOT make any claim whatsoever about the FLG party in Flushing. In fact, CCP simple doesn’t know anything about it. None of those angry Chinese immigrants in Flushing who boo’ed at the FLG party were CCP members. So just drop it. Your hatred toward CCP is so strong that blinds you from realities and makes yourself too many enemies.

  39. phy

    Again to Han Ren, since you suspected specul8r, let me remind you that it’s not any surprising at all that an average NON-CCP Chinese people has a “vengeance” sort of feelings toward FLG (I for one is an example). But who can blame those for that? Stories such as the one reported here are the reasons why more and more Chinese are developing a very bad opinion toward this cult. I certainly give FLG the right of claiming themselves “a religion”, but that doesn’t automatically stop people from hating them if they keep doing terrible things. Religion or not is not the point, and it has nothing to do with religious freedom either. The point is they keep uttering most blatant lies beyond normal people’s imagination about China (not that China is free of problems, but if you trust what FLG say, you would actually be much less mistaken if you claim China is perfect), and they keep saying ridiculous things such as calling the earthquake a “bad karma” that supposedly was invited by CCP. Just watch those video clips: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmHRRzBVks, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GrhN9DU7Yk. Now, if you call those Chinese people CCP, then you need to have your brain checked.

  40. terminator

    To Han Ren:

    “why dont you go to FLG’s official site and see it for yourself on what is their actual position on the matter?”

    I just went to minghui.org, falundafa.org, faluninfo.net, and several other websites by FLG. I noticed an immediate difference between FLG websites and any well-known news agents regarding to the earthquake disaster: while the latter are reporting extensively about the earthquake stories, the rescue efforts, the relief works, and the donations, FLG websites have little coverage. If there are some on FLG websites, the reports focused on attacking the Chinese government such as the one you have mentioned. So would you please tell us, what you think about FLG’s position based on their “news” coverage about the quake?

  41. terminator

    To Han Ren:

    To your argument about the video of “quitting the Communist Party”. Well, if you do not believe the Chinese government’s video, that is fine. Let’s take a look at FLG’s own media. On today’s homepage of DaJiYuan, FLG claims that 37m CCP members have quitted CCP. What does that mean? There are about 65m CCP members. So out of two CCP members, one has quitted. Please go to China and do a investigation by yourself – of course privately. You will know the truth. I am sitting here, wait for the moment that FLG claims all 65m CCP members have quitted. Then let’s see what FLG will do when CCP disappears from this world. Hahahaha.

  42. Han Ran

    Terminator,

    You do realise the strctness on FLGassociates in china right? as such I dont think FLG’s journalists can actually go to sichuan and do their own reports. therefore they dont really have anything to cover that isnt already covered by everyone else.

    In chinese version of faluninfo.net, there is an article about the Flushing event, the author declared that she was just as saddened by the tragedy as everyone else and made donation immidiantly.

    yes, you do see a lot of articles they have recently published blaming CCP the the high death toll, btu that is exactly what they are meant to do – I mean, as an religious group exiled from your own country because of your religion, what else do you set up a website for apart from take every chance you get to criticise your ex- government?

    my point is there is nothing on their site about them believing the earth quake to be bad karma of the sichuan people.

    Alessandro,

    earth quarke’s exact timing can not be predicted, and no one is saying it has been. but it is predicted to an approximated period, meaning as a responsible government CCP should have done more in areas of encourage relocation, building inspection and re-enforcement. but what had CCP done? abslutely nothing at all, even Wen Jia Bao himself had heavily criticised local officials for their inaction after been nitified of the prediction report.

    as for curruption problems exist every country, mate I bet you my house that you dont understand the scale of the problem in China, unless you come from one of the even worse countries such as India, Burma or Indonisia. when all buildings in a region do not fall but the newly built schools, you cant use any exuse to defend these blood sucking bastards.

    Phy,

    Just drop it?
    My hatred towards CCP?
    Too many emeies I made ?

    Dude what sort of crack are you smoking? This is a bloody internet news site and I am expressing an opinion, heard of freedom of speech? Maybe not where you came from.

    as for “CCP is NOT make any claim whatsoever about the FLG party in Flushing. In fact, CCP simple doesn’t know anything about it.” — You can not be more wrong. CCP is making every effort to condam FLG using the Flushing event. in all reports from medias under CCP’s control, it shows FLG in an extremely negative light, quoting their signs read “god will distroy CCP, god will distroy china”, whereas in fact the sign actually reads ” god will distroy CCP, god will protect china”.

    that and the fact that what happened in Flushing was not a donation related event, there were no donation signs, stands, or event orgnisors, but all titles from CCP medias read “FLG disrupt Sichuan Donation event”

    “None of those angry Chinese immigrants in Flushing who boo’ed at the FLG party were CCP members.”

    and just HOW did you discover that fact?

    who is blind now?

  43. Han Ran

    terminator,

    one mistake you made (delibrate or not), along with many others, is to assume FLG is an well orgnised anti-CCP orgnisation, thus it must be responsible for every detail it says.

    the real pictures is that most people who run and write stuff on FLG sites are simply ordinary people that got very pissed off, for CCP destroying their religion and killing their fellow practitioners, they are not truth journalists who can engineer perfect consparicies against CCP. 37 million is obviously a overboasted number – I dont think there had been that many CCP members in the history of CCP. The point is only to encourage these whoe feel the same way to move forward and do the “quit”. if you can not even see this and stuck on the sematics of it, I dont think you are really intellectually fit for such complex issues.

    ======

    Once again, I’d like to make it clear that I do not follow FLG myself, for I was never impressed with the book Zhuanfalun and think many theories LiHongZhi invents are quite laughable, but no more laughable than what I find in may other religions, If everyone else are allowed to exist, why pick on FLG.

    furthermore most FLG people I have met are really decent people who just want to have some sort of direction in life, which is what you will find lacking in modern China.

  44. Alessandro

    Han Ren,

    as many have already said (including myself) it is sure and undeniable that it could have been done more and better in prevention of erathquake damages, but that’s true in EVERYcountry, and keeping on blaming CCP or whomever for this just show ur bias and ur complete un-objectivity. As for the previous notification of the danger of the quake…let’s talk about California..will we? It is only a matter of time till the “Big One” earthquake will hit that area…i don’t see any relocation policies enacted over there..I don’t see S. Francisco and Los Angeles moved, I don’t see tens of millions of people moved in other, safer locations…simply cause it is not possible, cause also NOBODY will be willing to leave everything he/she has cause there’s a possibility a quake will hit sometime in the future (and it can even happen after his/her death..there’s no way to know). Same goes for Japan and other extremely seismic areas and countries, mine included (i’m Italian).
    And Sichuan is NOT anywhere near the same level of seismicity of the discussed areas (California S. Andreas Fault area and Japan), and also is not yet anywhere near the same level of wealth.
    If u wanna make a statement about earthquake prevention and the need to stress about a strict application of anti-seismic building techniques in general u’re most welcome…But to use this natural disaster to push forward ur own political views and ur own bias is, frankly, not any less criminal IMHO.

  45. Alessandro

    By the way…I happen to be married to a chinese woman, and I think I know quite well the situation in China, corruption included, thanks:)
    Only, I try to keep an open and objective mind before launching accusation so general. That’s the difference.

  46. terminator

    To Han Ren:

    I must thank you for giving me a good entertainment this morning for your arguments below:

    “the real pictures is that most people who run and write stuff on FLG sites are simply ordinary people that got very pissed off, for CCP destroying their religion and killing their fellow practitioners, they are not truth journalists who can engineer perfect consparicies against CCP. 37 million is obviously a overboasted number – I dont think there had been that many CCP members in the history of CCP. The point is only to encourage these whoe feel the same way to move forward and do the ‘quit’. if you can not even see this and stuck on the sematics of it, I dont think you are really intellectually fit for such complex issues.”

    It seems that your opinion is: if someone hates CCP, he can use whatever lies to attack CCP. And for other people, they have to agree with his actions. Otherwise, they are not “intellectual” enough. I am sorry, as a science major Ph.D., I cannot accept this kind arguments. My training forces me to seek for only truth, but not lies.

    And you mentioned that FLG journalists were not allowed to enter China. Sure I understand that. So does that mean they even could not quote other media coverage? Ironically, when I looked at FLG web sites, I saw lots of detailed stories on how believing LiHongZhi saved people’s lives during the earthquake disaster. Those reports are unbelievably more detailed than the stories in most other media. If FLG journalists could not get into earthquake area, how did they get those details? If they could get these details, why were they so blind to the coverage of other media?

    BTW, do you feel what FLG did sounds a little bit familiar? Oh yeah, Da-liar Lama and his exile group does the same thing – use numerous lies to attack the Chinese government. And we know they and FLG are both funded by CIA (in another name, NGO today). So, may we get some kind of conclusion here?

  47. terminator

    To Han Ren:

    You said “one mistake you made (delibrate or not), along with many others, is to assume FLG is an well orgnised anti-CCP orgnisation, thus it must be responsible for every detail it says.”

    I demand your apology for making me puke my breakfast for your argument above. I cannot think of any not-well-organized organisation to have its own daily newspaper, TV channel, professional anti-CCP news websites, and professional anti-CCP protesters.

  48. specul8r

    To Han Ren,

    You asked “specul8r, i wonder if you actually work for the chinese government, because you certainly sound like you got a vengence against FLG.”

    For your record, I do not work for chinese government and I have no connection at all with them. I am just a normal U.S. Citizen. I had touch up on falun gong before for about a year but I started to see they are not practicing of what they preach. They are narrowly focusing their “saving people” in their own terms to save their falun gone believers being persecuted (per their definition) and not truly understanding of what “saving people” mean from spiritual point of view. Their ideology is all borrowed terms from other religions and then they start bashing other religions to make themselves look better. I dare you to go and comapre their book with another famous spiritual leader J. Krishnamurti. You can see for yourself what is truly mean to be spiritual and not the dogma of it. Li didn’t just bash other religions but when he started out, he bash other qigong masters to make himself looks better and want more fame.

    You said, “before I get accused like bio99 did, I shall declare that I do not practice FLG, nor associate with anyone that is part of FLG, I am simply a neutural person who believes FLG is just like any other religion, its followers are simply eligious.”

    They are not religious. They have shallow understanding of what “universe” means from buddhism. Their understanding of “universe” means those stars and galaxies and most spiritual religions definition of “universe” means the “universal consciousness”. When you borrowed other religions ‘terminologies’ without fully understanding the definition, you are setting up for failure. Falun Gong (or falun gone) always flip-flop when it comes to religion/qigong definition.

    You wrote “1 …

    firstly the authentiticity of the quotes and screenshots featured in this CCP made anti-FLG video, is highly questionable, secondly even if they were all true, last part of it would have been intentionally comical, as having modern non-mainland chinese celebrities included in the withdraw list as well as Chairman Mao himself.”

    What is the identity of people who register that they quit Communist Party? Did they join Communist Party before they quit? Just like many of those western governments were saying to boycott to attend Beijing Olympics Opening Ceremony. Were they invited to attend yet?

    In a same logic, if I create “I quit Falun Gone site” and created signatures with many nicknames, even if you don’t practice FLG and still sign on with statements, what is the validity of that? Please explain.

    You wrote “how odd is that the supposed “donation for sichuan disaster” has not a single sign or organisor shown in that video? and how odd is that the only signs, a truck loads of them, happen to anti-CCP signs by the Withdraw-CCP Group? because it is clearly not a Sichuan donation related event.”

    I assume you don’t read Chinese and that’s why you have shallow understanding as you stated. Please learn Chinese of what falun gone people mean by “heaven destroy China” means (this sign is obvious in the videos and pictures). They want disasters after disasters to hit China as punishments for persecuting FLG believers and no compassion at all to those people, their livelihood and happiness destroyed. All Chinese people are united to save those people’s lives in Sichuan are not going to forgive FLG. Many of these Chinese people do not care about politics of China or FLG but they do care about “saving people” in Sichuan.

    You wrote “3, for the videos you quoted regarding the TianAnMen burning suicides, can you for one stop referencing CCP made martirials and check what the rest of the world think in Wikipedia please? and look at the ZhuanFaLun book to see where did it ever say one should burn himself to death? in fact why dont you read the part where it actually says about killing and suicide.”

    Are you sure you don’t practice FLG? You statement is exactly like those FLG members. In Buddhism/Hinduism, suicide is a form of killing and it’s prohibited. Remember, China has no freedom of religion for a long time under Communist rule and when the country open up in 80s, many people with shallow understanding of religion were given with false pretense in Zhuan Falun confuse all those people’s understanding. When they can’t deal with situations and since they practice FLG, they were thinking “if I die now, I will reach to the kingdom master promised in the book”. That’s the reason why all those masters do not transmit to everyone in the past because not everyone has the same opened “wisdom eye”. They have to select the best fit candidate to transmit from guru to student.

    You wrote “point being, Li is a religious leader, he writes a book and people buys it, there is nothing legally or morally wrong with that, what is wrong is exactly what you later mentioned, CCP burns them. I ask how many books has got burned by modern governments in the last 50 years? let a lone a book not abotu bombing or hate?

    sure, Li got richer than some from what he had been doing, but are you going to accuse all religious leaders who live a comfortable life? what about Dalai?, what about the Pope?”

    You sounded very much like FLG members and I suspect you are Neutral at all. What can you proof that Li is religious? In Tibetan tradition, you can trace the lineage how the dhama or “Fa” is transmitted from one master to the next. Can you say the same with Li? You want to compare Li to Dalai? Pope? Do you know, Dalai and Pope are both political leaders too?

    You wrote “5, on the subject of distructed schools killing children.

    In Japan, where earth quake happens often, what people do is run to schools in event of earth quake, because schools suppose to be build stronger and more earth quake resistant than any buildings. a chinese warlord in early 1900s said “If a local governer’s office stood better than a school in even of earth quake, the the local governer needs to be shot”

    Yet in this earth quake, schools the the only buildings that had all colipised, surrounding buildings, even the ones that were classified as “High Risk” did not fall.”

    Japan is an island with many earthquake activities and I am not surprised the schools and buildings are built to absorb these horizontal and vertical shocks. Do people in Sichuan ever thought about they will be hit by 8.0 Richter scale earthquake? Hindsights is always you can nitpicks what should have done this way or that. You are probably watching NTD TV and they only show the schools are collapsed because they don’t want you to see others. Go ahead and turn on the CCTV9 or other sources. China didn’t restrict news like western media portrayed and see for yourself. Buddha Sakyamui said “middle way is the best”. It’s up to you who you want to believe.

  49. specul8r

    To Han Ren,

    you wrote “what you and your neighbor thinks of FLG does not matter, not even the slightest. I too have read the book and I too dont much of it, but the simple fact is that millions of people believed into it, thus it became a religion.”

    That’s because you have known the wrong religion and people can say the same to FLG.

    You wrote “i dont think that much of The Bible either, and I am sure if I read the Karan I wouldnt think it has the greater truth and wisdom either, but that doesnt mean Christianity and Islam dont have a good reason to be dominating the world of religions.”

    Remember, there’s a difference between religion and spirituality. Religion needs establishment and spirituality do not. You can be spiritual anywhere without any affliation with religion. When you are spiritual, you give up all human attachments and you have to develope bodhichitta or universal love to everyone because that awaken your buddha nature. That’s exactly a true religion teach but wrong religion teach other nonsense.

  50. specul8r

    To Han Ran:

    you wrote “You do realise the strctness on FLGassociates in china right? as such I dont think FLG’s journalists can actually go to sichuan and do their own reports. therefore they dont really have anything to cover that isnt already covered by everyone else.”

    Don’t you forget, you have developed many softwares (downloadable from your FLG sites) that can be hidden and avoid being detected in China. You are telling me there’s no reporters can take snapshots or videos and send over the internet with these softwares?

  51. specul8r

    To Han Ren:

    You wrote “Once again, I’d like to make it clear that I do not follow FLG myself, for I was never impressed with the book Zhuanfalun and think many theories LiHongZhi invents are quite laughable, but no more laughable than what I find in may other religions, If everyone else are allowed to exist, why pick on FLG.”

    They have basically won their heart because you see them in all those parades that seem harmless and that’s what they want you to believe. It’s not what they do is matter. The whole thing started when ordinary Chinese people are mourning and pouring their savings to help Sichuan earthquake victims and all FLG people can do is to beat drum and gong to celiberate about “heaven destroy China” trigger the despicable behavior of FLG.

  52. Han Ren

    Alessandro,

    If I bought a Lada today does that mean I have the authority on Russian mechanic?

    on the subject of the warnings and preparation, I dont know what you dont get – 1, chinese officials had the warning, they could have doen a lot more with the buildings, 2, relocation of evtire population is not possible, but simly informing them could have saved many even if majoprity still choose not to move, 3, these schools were built in very poor qualities, so much that surrounding buildings did not falls, 4, china as a whole had a project that received billions donations over the past 20 years to build schools, this money have not been used to do the task it was intended. here I summeriesed it for you, I wont respond to you on this issue any further as it seems to be a waste time for both of us.

    terminator,

    when can you get it around your head, FLG is not an exile government orgnisation, it is an exile religious organisation, its people got pissed off and thus setup their own medias to attack CCP, but they are not professional consparicist. Personally I think they are doing a rather poor at it.

    specul8r,

    Please read what I wrote carefully, I have addresed that “heaven destroy China” is one of the lies created by CCP, the actual sign reads “heaven destroy CCP, heaven protect China”

  53. specul8r

    Han Ren,

    you got me on that one because I don’t read chinese and it has nothing to do with CCP, never been a member in my life. So, how is the heaven protecting China when the Earthquake disaster strikes? Stop the superstition if you want to take responsibility of your own fate and not rely on these superstitious thoughts.

  54. To all falun gone people, you should learn a lot from this man about compassion.

    http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-26146

  55. terminator

    To Han Ren:

    “when can you get it around your head, FLG is not an exile government orgnisation, it is an exile religious organisation, its people got pissed off and thus setup their own medias to attack CCP, but they are not professional consparicist. Personally I think they are doing a rather poor at it.”

    1. “FLG is not an exile government organisation” is not equivalent to “FLG is not a well-organized organization”.

    2. “Personally I think they are doing a rather poor at it” is not a proof that “FLG is not a well-organized organization”.

    3. Ask any strange on the street about the four characteristics I mentioned above about FLG, and you will see what people think about FLG.

    4. I must say, given FLGers’ almost zero credibility on their words, it is nearly impossible to give any credit to your claim that you are not a FLG practitioner. From your words here, I have to say that this is a rather logical implication.

    To be honest, I am perfect fine with FLGers if they practice their so-called “religion”. What I cannot stand is that they keep lying, lying, lying, and lying! And when people do not agree with them, they keep bothering people with their ridiculous and laughable lies. Just look at the Chinese in US here, how many are backing up FLG? Let me give you a simple example. Every time after a FLG related issue was raised in the Chinese students association’s mailing list in my school, the vast majority of the Chinese students expressed their objections and angry at FLGers. In China, you can claim that the Chinese government controls its people and the media such that ppl have to follow it. But here, do you think FBI will not interfere if the Chinese government still tries to control the students and the media? One of the most ridiculous arguments of FLG is the claim that ppl against FLG in NY were organized by the Chinese government.

    Of course, I totally understand why lying has become a basic instinct of FLGers. As I mentioned early, both FLG and Da-liar Lama are funded by CIA. And CIA is an excellent pupil of Dr Joseph Goebbels,
    the Propaganda Minister of the Nazi German. Dr Goebbels once said: “Repeat a lie a thousand times and it becomes the
    truth”.

  56. Alessandro

    Yes, it certainly is a waste of my and others’ time cause u won’t move from ur preconcived and funny idea (that, only u know why, applies only to China and to the BAD CCP and not to any other government and country on the planet)..it’s useless to speak on deaf ears.
    As for the Lada joke…looks like u really are at a loss for justification and excuses…Sorry if I remeber u that a wife is a person, a Lada is a car (u didn’t get it, right??;)) Being married with a chinese woman means that part of my family is in China, that we often go there, that I have strong ties and relationship with China and chinese and so on…is it more clear now? I know that that makes ur “aim” of blaming everything on the “evil” CCP a little more difficult, but maybe u should try to accept it.
    As for the rest….many other on these pages have answered to ur biased and kinda funny posts…no need to add anything else.

  57. Pingback: Sharon Stone:the earthquake is karma « The New Voice

  58. phy

    It’s pretty clear that it’s simply useless to discuss with certain kind of person. Let me just emphasize this again, watch these two video clips, and if someone insists that those were CCP members, that I myself will decide not to discuss politics with him any more: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmHRRzBVks, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GrhN9DU7Yk

  59. Alice

    My dad bought FLG founder’s book, 1st edition, out of curiosity. That was way before FLG became internationally famous. I remember laughing about the context. The founder said he was ” spritually on a higher level to Budda and Jesus”. That he has supernatual power ever since he was child. and tons of other bullshit. This guy is crazy, and those who believes him is also crazy.

    Why whould so many people believe in stupid cults is beyong my comprehension.

  60. specul8r

    see and hear for yourself is CCP involved? I wonder where are all those Falun Gone people go? Are they gone?

  61. specul8r

    another video: True Religion vs Cult

  62. Wing

    I live in HK. Personally I have not seen any fund raising here by Falungong so far for the earthquake. However, I still see them illegally gathering + broadcasting on the streets and hard-sticking their gigantic anti-communist posters to public areas particularly touristy areas.

    To be frank, what I see is even the law-enforcement here are afraid to clear them the Falungong from the streets — merely because the Falungong members always make a big scene out of everything and claim that China is abusing them.

  63. falun gong is evil

    Wing, that’s what the FLGers have done in the past. Anybody criticize them will be called CCP or are organized by the CCP. Chinese immigrants in New York protested FLGers’ celebration on the earthquake and the FLGers called the protest was organized by the Chinese embassy. If I was in NY I would protest just as those who did. Nobody need be organized. Only the FLGs are organized.

    The FLG claim their principles as Truthfulness, Compassion, and Forbearance. These are just their deceitful bogus veins to cheat the public and gain sympathy around the word.

    Truthfulness: FLG lied over and over again and are darn liars and they don’t have any creditworth among our overseas Chinese at all.

    Compassion: FLG only care about their own interest and push their own agenda at the expense of everything else. For an earthquake that had killed more than 65000 (potentially around 80000) and injured more than 300000 people and they celebrate on it. Fuck them, their consciousness and heart were eaten by Li Hongzhi.

    Forbearance: FLG can’t take any criticism. If you do they will attack you all around and bother you like a chewed gum sticks on you shoe.

    In United States it’s so easy to blame CCP and people who do this can always get away and be accepted by the American government and American public. Politics is a dirty game played everywhere by every government due to various competitions and diplomacy games. Any organizations against the Chinese government were supported by the US government via CIA and a lot of them are financially supported. The mainstream media are often biased and are in favor of these organizations. It’s very simple: to be politically correct and to favorably feed the public needs. For the American public the complexity of foreign affairs are simply too much for them to understand and know the truth and most of them don’t care at all. Even some care it’s usually very simple for them and a very simple case is: oh, these FLGers are against communism and they must be good and I will support them. The FLGers just take advantage of this and link anyone who oppose them with CCP. But this time on the earthquake I believe a lot of Americans will start to question themselves if the FLG is that innocent even they are propagandizing that the protesting mob were organized by the Chinese embassy.

    Phy and others, it’s fruitless and wasting time to discuss with those FLG followers. I had done this so much and I knew it. So I simply ignored them and their bullshit. But the earthquake is so painful and they celebrate it just to prove Li Hongzhi’s so called bad karma and push their agenda. I am so disgusted and angered by these FLG scums. This is the only reason I post. Again, I will never understand how Li Hongzhi could brainwash so many people, and some of them are really nice and smart people when the FLG shit did not kick in.

  64. It is the story

    I’m very surprised to know that FLGers were “celebrating” the earthquake! Are they human beings or human trash? There are lot of different styles of Qigong in China, why is only this one single pointed by the CCP? Very simple, it’s organized cult. When people around me talk about FLG, they all look down or laugh at them. Why? These people are so stupid, heavily brain washed by somebody who is so ugly and disgusting. I just can’t believe people treating this guy like the living god!? Maybe one day I’ll have my portrait put in front of the picture of the bright shiny sun and gather some idiots to form a new organization and I can save everyone’s live…

  65. KingKong

    It is outrageous that FLG celebrates the earthquake in light of the devastating lost of lives and human sufferings. I’m sure there are a lot FLG followers were killed in the quake. But FLG still choose to celebrate, which can only prove its evil nature. It’s a shame that National Endowment for Democracy, an extension fund of CIA, is still using taxpayer’s money to fund this organization. I’m here call on all concerned citizen to 1) get the word out, 2) write to your congress representatives, ask them to stop funding FLG, and save taxpayer’s money.

  66. Jerry Chen

    I am glad most of the westerns are now realizing the FLG’s true cult nature. They have no any sympathy on human beings. How could they celebrate other’s suffering? Even they don’t like the CCP, most of the earth quack victims are regular Chinese people.

    One thing I should mention is that in the Chinese version of the Master Li’s book, he claimed that he is all God’s God. I am not sure whether all his western supporters agree with him?

    • westerners have yet to connect the dots. the terorists in Syria, and the flg have a common source among them. if westerners realised what was going on, theyd overthrow their own govt

  67. Tim

    Falun Gong not so innocent

  68. specul8r

    Why these falun goners are doing what the leaders told them to do

    Try to listen Li’s lectures or read the lectures posted on their faluninfo.net. Li became like godlike when some people with mild medical problems are cured by practicing FLG. Nobody knows the true effect and FLGers thought the master’s spiritual bodies are protecting them. In reality, anyone who do meditation regularly can reverse their mild medical symptoms and it’s been recorded in Buddhist and Hindu transcripts whtiout knowing any Qi Gong at all.

    In their ‘fa’ convention, then he started to threaten those members that if they don’t follow what he is asking to do such as propagandize CCP’s faults, give free classes to attract new members, participate in conventions, protests and parades in various cities and various events, etc. or else he is going to remove all those power from them and on the judgement day, gods will come down and destroy human lives but only the FLG practioners who follow his order will be saved. Many times, he will instill fear into their consciousness that these members are lax in their duties and he is not going to help them achieve to the ‘consumation stage’, which is their ‘nirvana’. So, all these people are being afraid not to be part of FLG and they are being brainwashed and believed that gods are coming down to earth to destroy non-FLG believers.

    I have seen the group has been getting less and less support. Taiwanese Democratic Progressive Party has lost power and this has hugh blow to the support of FLG. When all these donations are going to Sichuan Earthquake Relief, they got jealous and also believe their leader’s statement has come true – gods will destroy human lives – and without any “compassion”, they gathered to do this stupid event during this sensitive time. In case you all didn’t know, their ‘fa’ conference appears like a success with thousands of people attending is just a make believe. Many people who attend these conventions are from various neighboring cities to gather there to appears like FLG group is growing. In reality, each city has much less believers than they want you to believe.

  69. Roger

    Fulan Gong was created less than 20 years ago. It’s a scam religion made out of a mix of old taoist and buddhist philosophies. Hence, they were shut down…They got to marketing themselves well because of US govt support(anti-communist sentiments).

    Religious Freedom is one thing but cults are another…remember Jim Jones? Aum and the Tokyo subway bombings? Scientology?

    FLG isn’t a concern for China, it’s now a concern(or should be) for the US because they are operating on US soil.

  70. Roger

    Qigong has been practiced for centuries in China. bio99 and Dana Churchill are trying to piggyback the cult activities of FLG with this wide Chinese practice to project the false claim that China is clamping down on a harmless excercise.

    Qigong is like yoga but FLG is trying to make a buck by saying THEIR qigong is ‘magical’.

  71. Vodka

    this article made me feel quite sick…
    one of my closest friends is an active member of FLG, and she lives in NY.
    just the suggestion that she, the FLG, or ANYONE would celebrate or be happy about the death of possibly 50,000 people is disgusting.. the exception of course is the westboro church.. not even going to go there.
    im really quite disgusted that someone would bother to write something so biased and accusational

  72. falun gong is evil

    Vodka, it’s not “suggestion” that FLG celebrate on earthquake. Celebration was what FLG did. I am Chinese and the way that FLG behaved is typical celebration in Chinese way. They can deceive Americans but will never cheat we Chinese. If you care about this then dig deeper and you may end up joining in FLG or distanting yourself from them. You have close friend active in FLG and I had many more than you have. I had gone through this.

  73. Vodka

    I don’t have any intentions of joining or distancing myself from FLG.
    My friend is not a bad person, and she would never celebrate the death of thousands of innocent people. I really doubt they were celebrating the earthquake… sure, they were protesting / celebrating something.. but to say they were happy about death? that China deserved the earthquake? That’s disgusting.
    Regardless, China is/was run by communists, and they have done some horrible things.. (such as the Tiananmen Square massacre) they are/were by no means innocent. But of course they did not DESERVE an earthquake, nor did anyone deserve to die. The images on the news upset me a great deal, as they would have upset anyone. Some FLG practitioners probably have friends and family living in China, that’s no reason to celebrate…
    I just don’t think it’s right to say FLG practitioners were celebrating the death of all those people, regardless of how much you dislike the FLG that does not mean they are heartless savages.
    It’s kinda stupid to generalise a group of people based on a subjective blog post anyway…….

  74. Roger

    Er…they WERE actually celebrating the death of those 60, 000 people dude. Are people heartless enough to celebrate it? Yeah, well Sharon Stone was stupid enough to insinuate it was karma that the it happened because of China’s role in Tibet…though she failed to realize 50% of the people in the region affected are from Tibet.

    “Regardless, China is/was run by communists, and they have done some horrible things.. (such as the Tiananmen Square massacre) they are/were by no means innocent. ”

    The US Govt supported the Contra rebels who in turn massacred innocent civilians in the most brutal possible way. Think death squads, rape, torture etc

    Does that mean every American is guilty?

    The Chinese Government is not innocent but the people who were victims of the earthquake are.

  75. terminator

    To Vodka:

    I hate to distract the focus, but I must say something here off-the-topic regarding your comments below:

    “Regardless, China is/was run by communists, and they have done some horrible things.. (such as the Tiananmen Square massacre)”.

    Please take a look at the link below regarding the so-called “Tiananmen Square Massacre”:

    http://tiananmenmyth.blogspot.com/

    According to many western eye witnesses and declassified NSA documents, there was no so-called massacre at all! However, the western media have been dedicated to spread this propaganda for years till today, and I bet they will continue doing so in the future.

    I believe it is a human nature for a government and the media to demonize other governments in order to make their people feel comfortable. And the western governments and the media are particularly skilled to create propaganda and brainwash their people, such as tiananmen squre massacre, sudan genocide, tibet genocide, and the list goes on and on.

  76. To Vodka,

    I live in New York, Falun goners have been CELEBRATING FOR 10 days, they even paraded on Sunday.

    Yes, they are very happy that such disaster happened in China.

    They are nice people, go try talking about China, show some doubt about their “DAFA”, you will see their craziness.

  77. To Vodka,

    Just say something good about China or chinese government to your friends, and watch out his reaction.

    Just ask him something about their leader, you will see that they are brainwashed. They will tell you that Li HongZi was from other galaxy and Falun Da Fa is the law of universe.

    I personally dont consider them as Chinese any more. you can ask your friend if he considers himself as Chinese or American.

  78. specul8r

    to Vodka,

    “I don’t have any intentions of joining or distancing myself from FLG.
    My friend is not a bad person, and she would never celebrate the death of thousands of innocent people. I really doubt they were celebrating the earthquake… sure, they were protesting / celebrating something.. but to say they were happy about death? that China deserved the earthquake? That’s disgusting.”

    No one is accusing your friend is a bad person; we are just saying regular practioners have been used by these evil Li and the upper echelon of the falun gone (like Zhang Erping and the top leaders) who are controlling the innocent people’s fear and try to isolate these people from the society. We are extending our hands to those falun goners to return to open the wisdom eye back without all these dizzing falun rotating in front of their eyes and they couldn’t see through clearly.

    Look, to be human is one thing but to be human without compassion is another. If falun goners have true “compassion”, they would have organize donations in every street conrners and collects for the earthquake victims. It’s as simple as that… “we may not have much money today but at least we have a warm home to come back, place to eat, and a place to sleep, and all family members are together… many earthquake survivals don’t have anyhing left. So, we should do the best we can and postpone the things we wanted to buy with the money we have saved until later so those homeless earthquake victims can rebuild their lives”. This pure compassion can bring and raise one’s spiritual awareness level. Instead, they were blaming government didn’t do anything in the first 30 hours after the quake. What do you think the government is doing? They are securing the Mianyang city, Chinese Academy of Engineering Physics (CAEP) located, to make sure nuclear safety. Don’t forget, these are mountainous road is hard to get in after the quake. The government have to make assessment after the quake.

    Tell me, falun gone people are saying the CCP is corrupt and they want to donate money directly to the people and then what? I bet they want to brainwash those people and tell them that the government is blah… blah… blah… negative propaganda. A spiritual person donate money not expecting anything in return but when falun goner wants to donate money, they expect these citizens to revolt against their government. That’s very political thing which they said they were never political. It’s never a spiritual.

    You wrote “I just don’t think it’s right to say FLG practitioners were celebrating the death of all those people, regardless of how much you dislike the FLG that does not mean they are heartless savages.”

    They didn’t exactly celebrating the death but they were extremely happy that the disaster after disaster fall upon China so China’s economy will choke and people will revolt against China. Then, their wish to get rid of CCP will be fulfilled. Did you get my point or should I drill deeper down?

  79. specul8r

    to vodka,

    terminator wrote “I believe it is a human nature for a government and the media to demonize other governments in order to make their people feel comfortable. And the western governments and the media are particularly skilled to create propaganda and brainwash their people, such as tiananmen squre massacre, sudan genocide, tibet genocide, and the list goes on and on.”

    If you don’t believe terminator, go and check out the site http://www.anti-cnn.com/

  80. Vodka

    to whoever asked if i think all americans are guilty for whatever the american government does or has done in the past……..

    “But of course they did not DESERVE an earthquake, nor did anyone deserve to die. The images on the news upset me a great deal, as they would have upset anyone.”

    i see no difference from you defending the CCP to me defending the FLG… you think the CCP is being misrepresented by the FLG, and I think you’re misrepresenting the FLG.

    im not going to argue with you anymore because the whole thing makes me feel sick… half the things you’re saying to me have nothing to do with what i said.
    no one wants innocent people to die and i think its hurtful to accuse others of such a thing.

  81. simon1749

    Have you heard stories for FLG members as such: A Chinese police officer and his families all died without suddenly after the officer arrested some FLG members? This is good enough to demonstrate the nature of FLG. A police arrested FLG members caused the death of his entire family (the punishment from heaven). Yet, the people in Sichuan supported the CCP government which brought bad karma to them. If you still couldn’t believe how ugly these FLG members are, please check out this link, and watch how one of the FLG member’s (her name is Jana) attitude toward the quake.
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/foreign/richardspencer/may2008/shaken-beijing.htm
    here is the link to a ny times report about the instance.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/26/nyregion/26falun.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
    Clearly that FLG held a parade on Sunday when the entire China is mourning the deaths in the quake.

  82. falun gong is evil

    If there is no FLG influences on their brain those FLGers may not celebrate the earthquake. But their perception that Li Hongzhi’s prophesized prediction was proved outweighs their consciousness and intelligence. So they feel so excited and happy and do those celebration stuff. You can see how insane these FLGers is. This is earthquake, a mother nature’s thing, and they behaved so crazy, let along on other societal issues. Li Hongzhi has been worshipped by his followers as a living god, a god above any another god by his claim. He is behind this and at least he knows what’s going on and happy to see what his followers had been doing. If he said something like “this is sad disaster and let put our disagreement on hold for a while” his followers would go back home. Indeed he would never do this and he is very happy to see the chaos on the street and his TV station and newspaper and websites are in full throttle to propagandizing all these stuff.

    One world: Li Hongzhi is evil.

    FLG is not harmless. They may not go out to damage a property or stab a person. But they harm people’s brain and brainwash them and infill his evil thought and cause societal disturbance. Now he is not much of threat in China. But he is a dangerous element in American society. Americans, do you want to see more and more Americans become insane by following Li Hongzhi? Why do you allow your government support such a scum? Think about it.

  83. Anonymous

    Here’s a different account of the event by the New York Times :
    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/26/nyregion/26falun.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

    Falun Gong Marchers Are Jeered in Chinatown

    By COLIN MOYNIHAN and CARA BUCKLEY
    Published: May 26, 2008

    Anguish over the recent earthquake in China helped set off a small ideological disturbance in Chinatown on Sunday when a Falun Gong parade was jeered by supporters of the Chinese government who hurled water bottles and pieces of pastry at the marchers, as well as insults.

    On Sunday morning, men stood near the Grand Street subway station soliciting money that they said would be used to help victims of the May 12 earthquake in Sichuan Province, which killed more than 60,000 people. At some point, Chinatown residents said, rumors spread that Falun Gong was discouraging donations and telling people that the Chinese government would steal the money.

    Tensions between Beijing and practitioners of Falun Gong, a form of exercise and meditation, are nothing new. After the Chinese government outlawed Falun Gong in 1999, the group began mounting international publicity campaigns accusing the government of repression. Those tensions do not usually boil over here as they did on Sunday, but the rumors seemed to arouse anger just as the parade was moving through Chinatown.

    Falun Gong members denied the rumors and attributed them to provocateurs conducting a campaign of misinformation.

    “Our message is very benign” said Erping Zhang, a Falun Gong spokesman. “We have compassion for the people in the earthquake.” He also charged that the opposition was organized, a claim that could not be verified.

    Things were calm along much of the parade route, but as the marchers moved down East Broadway and beneath the Manhattan Bridge overpass — some of them holding aloft banners and placards that read “Only Without the Communist Party There Will Be a New China” and “Earthquake Cover Up Cost Lives” — the atmosphere became charged.

    People on the sidelines hooted and booed. A brass band in the parade competed with a scratchy version of the Chinese national anthem that blared from unseen speakers.

    The marchers raised their thumbs in the air and, in return, spectators gave the thumbs-down sign while chanting a derisive oath in Chinese.

    Plastic water bottles flew through the air, aimed at the marchers. At times, members of the crowd surged into the street and were pushed back by police officers, who also escorted stragglers from the parade who were wearing yellow T-shirts linking themselves with Falun Gong.

    “These people all grew up in China,” said a young man in the crowd who would identify himself only by his first name, Lin. “They listen to the Chinese government.”

    The parade ended shortly after 1 p.m., and many of the marchers gathered in a park near Grand and Chrystie Streets. Among them was Mr. Zhang, who said he had relatives in Sichuan who had been displaced by the earthquake.

    “We have seen that schools fell,” he said. “We are concerned.”

    The police said that while there were scuffles during the parade, no one was arrested.

  84. falun gong is evil

    I can see the journalist and the nytimes were sided with the FLG as I have often seen on the main stream media.

  85. terminator

    NYTimes does not surprises me. It is a typical one-sided story – without a single interview on the other side.

    Indeed, I think the western media are even worse than CCP’s state media. At least, we know CCP’s state media are directly backed by the Chinese government, and their news coverage are biased. The western media, without explicit pictures showing their relations with their government, enjoy a much better standpoint to brainwash their people.

    It reminds me some movies. When one sees gangs hanging around the street, he knows that they are bad guys. But criminals like Mr. Brooks (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0780571/) are particularly difficult to identify and can pose greater danger to innocent people.

  86. physicall

    To the Anonymous who posed the Ny Times article…

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/26/nyregion/26falun.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

    Thing is, the article you posted is about a different incident(not this one). If you read more carefully, the article is actually about a Falun Gong parade that happened AFTER this incident. Please get your facts right before you accidentally deceive anyone please.

    By the way, it seems that the Falun Gong marchers have decided to get rid of the “Heaven destroy China” theme; probably because it shatters their image of being peaceful practitioners.

  87. physicall

    Note to “terminator” and “falun gong is evil”

    See above!

  88. physicall

    One more thing; I think the Falun Gong marchers were setting themselves up to be attacked-so they could play the victim yet again.

  89. falun gong is evil

    I knew they are separate events and I even watched how the FLG tv station broadcast it on youtube. FLG very often played as victim to win sympathy from the western world and so far it worked very well for them.

  90. physicall

    lol you should check out their “Nine Commentaries about the Communist Party”; it’s amazing that they can still call Ming Pao and Sing Tao biased!

  91. specul8r

    source: http://www.anti-cnn.com/forum/en/thread-1904-1-1.html

    what i learn on the western media
    A devastating disaster came!

    We won’t be defeated.

    The western media remains silence when they withnessed our government’s quick action and perfect relief aid!

    While some of them still misunderstood China and its government.They accused that it was unfair that China turned

    down their request of coming to China to do some commentary report.

    When I heard this news,I was quite striking.I know that you western people consider life as everything.How can you

    commented that China had done wrong.

    As we all know,every minute counts,even in rescuing time.I don’t know why can you come up with such a foolish question.

    You said that you have the rights to report the truth. But you don’t have the rights to add burdens to the government there.

    Chinese government now focus on rescuing people who are still suffering.They have no time for your visit and have no extra

    hand to protect you.

    Please think of others before thinking of yourself.If you can’t,you can’t be a real journalist or reporter,cause your purpose

    is very simple,which is money or others.

    All in all, I am not going to against the western media.It’s their fault,not mine.I needn’t to be angry about those lies.It’s no use.

    What I going to do is to protect and construct my country.And we’ll be stronger and stronger.

    At last,welcome to Beijing!

  92. Jennifer

    I’ve seen similar blog posts elsewhere on the internet. Do you actually believe anyone actually cares to hear your nonsense? Why does “The New Voice” sound alot like the same old same old from tools of the CCP? Considering the brutal methods the CCP used to suppress Falun Gong, I am not at all suprised that they are still quite angry. How would you feel if you had family members tortured and murdered for absolutely no good reason what so ever?

    Furthermore, any members of Chinese diasporas, or members of diasporas of any national origin for that matter, that attempt to infringe upon the free-speech or freedom of religion of US citizens via intimidation should be deported from this country PERMANENTLY. To use CCP style rhetoric, “Such acts hurt the feelings of the American people and are an affront to American values and principles.” BTW, I am not anti-Chinese, but I will not condone barbaric tactics of Chinese citizens in my own country. As I see more and more of such shameful acts being perpetrated by Chinese citizens, I lose more and more respect for them.

  93. specul8r

    You are contradicting yourself; peaceful people will not get angry; enlightened people will not get angry because they know what is enlightened means and people who don’t usually think they are enlightened but they are not. If you want to know more on spiritual words, go and read J. Krishnamurti and you will understand what I am talking about.

    To instill fear will have no affects on people who has done everything according to the law. We didn’t burn cross and we didn’t spray swastika on the walls of synagogue or things like that nature. How are we intimidating, madam? We are expressing our disgust of why falun gone members are not doing as normal human beings should to help the suffering fellow chinese people in their homeland; instead, they were celebrating days after days of “heaven destroy china”. Even if they don’t have donation drive, that’s understandable but why celebrating “heaven destroy china” during this emotional period? It’s very insensitive part of their culture that invoke regular Chinese to get angry at them.

    Let me ask you this, have you been to China and see things with your own eyes or you just hear hearsay from certain people? Many Americans and Canadians have completely change their stance against China after they actually visited China and Tibet, and started to realize their countries were feeding them biased news and recent FLG media is one of the source of negative biased news. For your information, I am not Chinese citizens and never been a member of CCP. 🙂

  94. Jen

    “they know what is enlightened means”

    “To instill fear will have no affects on people who has done everything”

    “We didn’t burn cross”

    Nice English. Don’t try to convince anyone your not a Chinese citizen. Your grammar errors give you away.

  95. suqing17

    lol, people who can’t speak perfect English are all Chinese. What an American logic…
    BTW, for “I lose more and more respect for them”, thank you! “Respect” from a cult follower who apparently has anger management issue is the LAST thing we want.

  96. Alessandro

    To Jennifer….please do not speak of barbaric act in ur country..it’s just so funny. A large part of the world is SICK and TIRED of the much more barbaric and terrorist acts YOUR country is committing in OTHER countries, for its own self-interest..so please, don’t even mention it. Your country is in no position to teach moral issues to ANYBODY in the world. If u really so dearly value the principles ur country (should) be built on, then protests against provocations and shouldn’t bother u at all. Even if all falun gong expat claims was real (and I strongly doubt it..as much as real studies and proof have dismissed many false claims from the so called “Tibetan government in exile”), to “rejoice” in any possible way (even using silly metaphors like that it was “heaven” punishing China, and so on) for the dead of more almost 80 thousand people is criminal, no more no less…and if u defend it, u’r criminal as well.

    By the way, before u start talking of CCP propaganda and other bull….s, i’d just like to inform u i’m not even chinese or have any remote chinese origins..I’m italian…And instead of the easy “excuse” of labelling everything u don’t like as CCP propaganda, so that u can dismiss it without confronting it, I have to sadly tell u that ur post and the behaviour of a large part of western media when it comes to China, and other realities far from our own common western culture, is the only real, continued propaganda here…

  97. falun gong is evil

    I haven’t found CCP style in this thread but did see Joseph McCarthy style and FLG style once Jennifer posted. Come down Jen, you seemed to be an angry, insecure woman but not confused with FLG and its propaganda. Your arguments are weak. I recommend you spend some time and money and go to visit China as suggested by others for a few weeks to see with your own eyes and to think with your own brain. After that you can continue to discuss this or join the FLG and learn from Li Hongzhi to reach higher and higher level as he promised. Li Hongzhi bless you 🙂

  98. simon1749

    To Jennifer,
    “Nice English. Don’t try to convince anyone your not a Chinese citizen. Your grammar errors give you away.

    Very nice English too.
    What is your ethnicity? Were you born in the US or somewhere else? Many US citizens were borned somewhere else and don’t speak/write fluent Englsh. Further more many ethnic Chinese born in Malaysia, Singapore, etc..

  99. terminator

    Here come Jennifers along with the CIA style of western propaganda again:

    One: something truth about Falun Gone…

    Jennifers: That’s Communist propanganda!

    Two: something truth about Tibet…

    Jennifers: That’s CCP propanganda!

    Three: something truth about China…

    Jennifers: You commies stop propaganda!

    Four: anything not conforming the main stream western propaganda…

    Jennifers: You are Communists!

    WTF?!! Are we talking with real human beings, or just an answer machine of McCarthyism?

  100. Jen

    Wow. I have taught English to Chinese speakers before and I know exactly which kind of grammar errors they usually make.

    Terminator, nice try. Is that all you got? Comparing me to McCarthy? That’s just simple minded and ridiculus. Anyways, how can I take someone who calls themself “Terminator” seriously?

    Allesandro, it’s a common tactic for people to try to deflect criticism of one thing by refering to something else which is apparently just as bad or worse. However, that does not at all diminish the reality of atrocities commited against Falun Gong.
    Besides, I don’t believe for a moment that you are Italian and not Chinese.

  101. physicall

    To terminator, Jen, falun gong is evil, Alessandro and specul8r:
    PLEASE, please don’t just throw insults at each other; it would be better for your respective viewpoints if you argued on the point.

    BTW, my viewpoint on the Falun Gong is that they are really a cult; as Jen said:”How would you feel if you had family members tortured and murdered for absolutely no good reason what so ever?”
    Precisely! WHY would the CCP “had family members tortured and murdered for absolutely no good reason what so ever?” The CCP is not stupid you know. Jiang Zemin must have at least a half assed reason to crack down on a “spiritual practice” and ban it, particularly since this practice was practiced by many millions of Chinese people.

    Here I will argue my motivation to call Falun Gong a cult; Falun Gong is a cult simply because they are a group that simply will NOT allow criticism of their practice. The inner circles of Falun Gong do almost nothing else other than promote Falun Gong and its causes. Falun Gong practitioners generally refuse to give up viewpoints, even when the evidence is almost completely against such a viewpoint.

    Yesterday, I went to the Tulip Festival by Parliament Hill (on some hill I forgot the name of) and I noticed that Falun Gong members managed to put around 40 posters right in front of the main Parliament block. These posters were inscribed wtih such slogans like: “STOP THE PERSECUTION OF FALUN GONG”, “PRACTITIONERS ARE BEING TORTURED”, and “FALUN GONG PRACTITIONERS ARE HAVING THEIR ORGANS HARVESTED AS CONFIRMED BY KILGOUR AND MATAS”. These posters are seen practically everywhere in Ottawa which are are flanked by Falun Gong practitioners holding signs or doing a organ harvesting simulation(Only in noticeable places). These guys are out there like, 24/7 out there advertising their cause. They are always the same people as well.

    The question is: These guys have absolutely no lives other than advertising Falun Gong’s causes. Why are these guys so dedicated? Is it because they want to stop the organ harvesting? Some people may say that, but I don’t think so.
    I mean, look at Sudan and Zimbabwe today. The Sudanese civil war has already killed millions of people, the Zimbabwe regime has already killed hundreds of thousands of innocents and both are still going on. The Falun Gong claims that “thousands” are being tortured and having their organs harvested. Compared to what Sudan and Zimbabwe did, what China has done (according to the Falun Gong) is a farce. Since Sudan and Zimbabwe’s crimes so far outstrips China’s, why arn’t they more well noticed? You don’t see very many people trying to draw attention to Sudan’s or Zimbabwe’s crimes. And again, let me remind you that those crimes are many thousands more terrible than Falun Gong’s wildest claims as to waht has happened to them. So those people trying to draw attention to Falun Gong’s cause cannot be simply be horrified by China’s crimes because then there would be many more people trying to draw attention to Sudan or Zimbabwe instead.

    So why is Falun Gong so well advertised by such a loyal band of followers? It is clear from my last paragraph that these people cannot be simply trying to reveal China’s crimes to everyone. The reason for Falun Gong’s much overblown reputation is (Dum..dum..dummmm) because of their dedication to Falun Gong. Furthermore, their dedication reachs far enough so that these guys go out everyday to advertise their cause. Even Princess Diana didn’t ALWAYS work to help others all the time; she enjoyed her own comforts as well.
    The degree of unwavering support Falun Gong practitioners have for their practice is suspiciously powerful. These guys have almost no lives other than Falun Gong and self-sustenance, and refuse to believe anything bad of Falun Gong. To me: Unquestioning support to something=cultism.

    One more thing on unwavering support: the Falun Gong repeatedly use Kilgour and Matas as proof that systematic organ harvesting even when their report has been discredited by both a United Nations report and a United States investigation.

    Now here I would talk about the proofs Falun Gong has about organ harvesting in China, but I think I’ll leave it for later ( if I don’t forget)

  102. Alessandro

    Jennifer…the only one using common “tactic” (yes, let’s call it tactic, even if it is something else) here it is u….when somebody just dismiss the opponent resorting to the old excuse of propaganda, there’s little left to be said, won’t u think? When somebody who lives in a world full of propaganda, biased reports and distorted news, without even noticing it, accuses the other to be themselves propaganda-mongers, using the propaganda she herself has been fed since birth as the only arguments she has, then things become really really sad. If u have solid facts and solid knowledge about China and whatever else, than show it to us….if not, please, spare our time.

  103. Alessandro

    Ahahah….se non credi che io sia italiano, il problema è completamente tuo, e dimostra in toto il tuo pregiudizio e la tua cecità.

    For non-italian speaking : is u don’t believe I’m italian, the problem is totally urs, and it shows all ur prejudice and all ur blindness.

    Divertiti/enjoy

    Saluti da Roma

  104. physicall

    To Alessandro: disprove her, don’t just insult her.

  105. KingKong

    I don’t give a dam whether it’s communism or capitalism, as long as their people live a peaceful happy life, and human lives are respected.

    Angels all over the world is looking after the wounded and the dead, whether it is a prayer, a helping hand, or a generous donation. Only evil cult FLG is gloating, and having the guts to show the whole world how satisfied they are by paraded down the New York streets. Its inhuman behavior is against humanity and Red Cross. It will be judged by the divinity. And I don’t give a dam too if FLG is erased from the planet Earth.

    For those still hanging on to FLG, think about the outrage your evil cult provoked. It’s not too late to quit. It may save you from a class action law suit, or the destruction of yourself. I know it is very hard for you, but that can only prove it’s evil cult nature, just cocaine.

  106. Molly

    If I could quote from revelation. “The dragon waits for the child to be born, so that he can devour it.” The dragon is China. If the child is not a girl the parents get rid of the child. They kill it or they send it out to be adopted. This is not a practice of the government. This is a practice of the people. These people do not believe in God. If they did, they would certainly know God would send them to Hell for killing a child. Is the earthquake the wrath of God? I would say no. But he didn’t stop it either. He let them build homes of stone. They should have made homes made of sticks. God did not tell them that stones fall, and sticks bend. He also did not send a messenger to tell them what was about to happen. Now God sends messengers to Christians when something is going to happen. Many christians will have a dream about pending danger before it happens and will know what to avoid. Now why doesn’t God talk to the Chinese people? Maybe because they kill their babies. He could be made about that. That is just my thought. In America if you leave a baby in the dumpster and your caught, you are sent to jail for the rest of your life. In China people just look the other way. Maybe God looks away from them.

  107. Molly

    Now getting rid of Girl children is not just something Chinesse do. This is practiced in other Asian countries. Some asians that immagrate to America continue this practice here. They keep their girls in the house, never let them out. They don’t want neighbors to know who lives in the house. If they later have a male child, they get rid of the girl child.

  108. terminator

    Jeniffer:

    Feel bad for being compared to McCarthy? Then stop behaving like him, and stop anti-Communism hypercrisis. Next time when you disagree with someone, be sensible before you label him/her as Communist/CCP!

    FLG is lying all the time, and it seems that you believe their lies. I just point you a sample link regarding FLG’s constant lies about organ harvest below. Please do not tell me that the US government officials are brainwashed by the Chinese government!

    http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2006/April/20060416141157uhyggep0.5443231.html

    BTW, after reading the testimony, don’t you think FLG should be held accountable for spreading rumors (not just this single one, there are numorous other lies) and wasting tax payer’s money?

    Finally, I find an interesting scenario in your comments and man FLGers’. After facing undeniable truth, you guys either changed to a new topic or began to launch personal attack. Funny, what is the relation between my id and my comments here?

  109. physicall

    terminator has a point with the entire “terminator” name thing…but on the other hand, jen hasn’t really even mentioned communism so far.

    Oh yeah, I think specul8r is almost definitely related to China in some way…particularly when he said:”What I going to do is to protect and construct my country.And we’ll be stronger and stronger.”

    Any ideas about what country he’s talking about?

    And then he says this:”For your information, I am not Chinese citizens and never been a member of CCP. :)” which is contradicting his previous statement.

  110. KingKong

    Are we done with nationality issue? Let me make it clear. I’m a Chinese. Almost all of Falun Gong followers are Chinese. However I don’t give a dam if it’s a Chinese, or any other nationals, as long as humanity is respected, don’t get in the way of a funeral procession, or a memorial service, which is the line that I draw to single out the worst evil.

    I haven’t seen first hand police brutality against Falun Gong in China. But consider their extreme self centered, extreme aggressive nature, it would not be difficult to imagine the inevitable conflict, and the consequences in China is no good to say the least. By the way, by any standard, China is still considered third world. I wouldn’t be surprised to know that the police brutality rate is much higher than that of the United States.

    Having said that. Police brutality should be condemned no matter what. But I believe there’s still law in China, though not perfect, police brutality is condemned by the government. FLG can protest against the government for not doing an effective job, but they should never lie to the whole world, and never ever bloat about the disaster that has caused tens of thousand lives, including children, millions homeless, and get in the way of the moaning of the dead, and messes with up the donation drive for the victims.

    FLG is going down towards self destruction. Independent reports and analysis reveal that FLG has no respect of others. From time to time, they will brush with someone whom they wish they’d never had brushed with. Currently, though, they tried very had to ally themselves with anybody who are not Chinese, which is a safe bet. However, they will get in to the way who would regard them as trash. And the conflict is inevitable. The more they struggle, the more evil nature will be revealed to the world. Eventually they will be abandoned by the main stream. So the only door to them would be self destruction.

    To all concerned citizens, please take a look at “How To Detect Bias In News Media” published at http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=121
    The world would be a lot safer if citizens are educated, so that no one can be fooled.

  111. Alessandro

    Physicall…I just rebuffed her silly lies, only to prove that she’s wrong, and that she can’t keep on relying on lies and prejudices to prove her point, where’s the insult? The only insult here is some of her statements…Sorry if u can have felt otherwise..

  112. terminator

    Physicall:

    “jen hasn’t really even mentioned communism so far.”

    So, what does CCP mean?

    “Why does ‘The New Voice’ sound alot like the same old same old from tools of the CCP?”

    What does the above quote mean?

  113. physicall

    To terminator:
    The CCP obviously stands for Communist Party of China, but everyone knows that the Communist Party has pretty much abandoned all the ideals of communism in it’s policies 1990-present. Jen isn’t really mentioning anything about communism but is making a unfair accusation at just the CCP, not all communists. She’s simply randomly saying that everything is “suspiciously” CCP related, like she can tell.

    About her quote:
    “Why does ‘The New Voice’ sound alot like the same old same old from tools of the CCP?”

    To Jen:
    How does “The New Voice” sound a lot like a CCP propaganda front? Name one organization that has a name like “The New Voice” and is a CCP propaganda front plz. What about Voice of America? THAT sounds a lot like “The New Voice” but everyone knows “Voice of America” is owned by the US government.

    Conclusion:Don’t jump to conclusions on just a name.

  114. physicall

    Alessandro, you called her prejudiced and blind while Jen implied heavily that you were a CCP agent or at least a Chinese citizen posing as a Italian.

    I think that her implication made you a little angry and got you to call her “prejudiced” and “blind”.

    While you do have a bit of a point, it would be better if you just stuck to the point of this article.

  115. john

    Jeez, So much time, energy and emotions spent about “who is bad, who has done what to whom etc, etc..”

    As long as there is mankind someone will ALWAYS attempt to raise themself above the crowd and convince them they have power, intelligence or something which renders them omnipotent or some such like foolishness. Time always reveals their true motives and if it truly is of man, it will eventually fail. That is a “cult.”

    Let us forget and leave behind our emotions because they are varied, confused and undependable. Let us search for a common ground of decency in “all of our cultures”. It doesn’t matter where you are from, where you were born or how well you speak. What matters and will have eternal effects, is how we treat one another. FLG, CCP, US of A, and all the false theologies of the nations of the world, will one day disappear, along with of their foolishness, propaganda, and distortion of the TRUTH as it truly is.

    We need to build, not be critical of one another. If you would care to see a simple illustration of this, put one hand in front of you, into a fist, put out your index finger, leaving the other fingers closed. While you have the one finger pointing outward, away from you, move your arm about as if you were sighting a target. Look closely at your remaining didgets, not your thumb. What do you see? You will find three fingers pointing back at you. So…let us be mindful of our individual faults and not be so quick to always be on the look out for other’s weaknesses and follies. We each have enough dirt in our minds and lives to gag a billy goat.

    Let’s build on common ground and decency using kindness and compassion as the cement with which to bind us, as frail humans, together. In the end it won’t matter our individual or group philosophies. There is strength in unity and in purpose when we look for the good and not the evil. That there is evil is quite evident, but perfect love will always overcome that evil and cast out fear.

    With deep concern and prayers for you who are depressed, confused and care about our world which is groaning with words we cannot fathom, I say, “God bless and enlighten you as He wills.”

  116. physicall

    To john:
    Ideals. Your vision of everyone leaving their differences behind and building a society on common grounds is impossible, so long as there are elements in this world who continue to contradict one another. And again, there are those who refuse to build on that common ground, professing knowledge of the supernatural. Should we simply ignore these elements? So long as these elements remain prominent, it will be nearly impossible to ignore them, as they strive to be noticed.

    Contradictions and differences must be smoothed out before going on. Otherwise they will come back to haunt you eventually.

  117. john

    Physicall, you are absolutely right about the differences and those who continually strive for unrest. However, it has been the “visions” people have had in the past and those in the present which give our societies medicines, technology and advancement.
    Those who always seem to disrupt will be present but as long as we recognize them for who they are and what their motives are, we are safe from their influence over us.

    The common man, just wants to have peace and be able to survive and provide, no matter where he lives in the world.

    I speak six languages, have lived in Italy, Philippines, Vietnam, been to China several times, Germany, France, Belgium, Thailand, Arabia, Mexico, Canada and others I can’t recall. I have served in combat for two and a half years and seen the waste of lives fought over so-called injustices and ideologies, when the “chicken-hawks” in power won’t go to war themselves, but send the lower classes in the food chain to do the dirty work ,while they lie to the public and rape the economies for their personal enrichment and power. Every society I have been exposed to I have learned a great deal. I am not innocent or naive, as perhaps some who contribute to this blog may assume. I know about superstitions and so called religions and movements. Most most of their leaders have a very old and common goal, they think it is for personal glory, power and, even betterment of mankind, trying to deceive others, when in fact, being deceived themselves. We must be willingly to avail ourselves of the truth that is presented in the Gospel of Christ. (Oh, I can almost hear the indignant scream of MJ and others). Mankind has a very ancient, common foe. He is called Satan. He can be so compelling and innocent appearing and can even transform himself into an angel of light, but there is no light or life in him. His only agenda is death to man, period. He uses those under his influence to beguile those without vision. God’s Word states, “My people are destroyed for lack of vision.” It is our visions which offer us a better hope for the future during times of oppression and confusion.

    I repeat what I had written one other time, “if you want to know the Truth all you have to do is ask of God.” Ask Him sincerely and believe He will respond, no matter your beliefs, religion or background. He has promised to reveal it to you. Once it is presented and you can grasp it in your heart, you have the option of rejecting or accepting it, your life will never be the same. Guaranteed.

    For you see, God loves us so much He allows us to have free will, not as goverments or cults who want physical and mental control of our assets, actions and very existence. God loves diversity, variety, that’s why He created so many races and languages but He desires we all focus on His goodness and use each of our talents and abilities for edifying one another and thereby giving Him the glory, and us the victory over our common enemy. For we chose our ultimate destiny in the end. Do you want a “vision” of reality? Picture this, an eternity with God, no sickness, no earthquakes, no wars, no tears, no humiliation, no hunger or, one without God, full of pain and suffering without end in the fires of Hell,

    Your move, chose the “vision” which appeals to you most. Our Creator loves you so much He allows you to chose your destiny. He even provided the WAY. What other so-called god has ever done that?

  118. Alessandro

    Phisical, u’re right it’d be better to stick to the article in question..but, and it weren’t her doubts about my nationality or whatever (that only amused me, cause confirmed in full what I already thought of her attitude) to piss me off (not make me angry), but her attitude, an attitude that so many other people have unfortunately, that makes confrontation and dialogue almost impossible, cause it just dismiss whatever u say or u can say as CCP propaganda or similar, avoiding any real confrontation on actual facts.

  119. specul8r

    To Jen,

    “they know what is enlightened means”

    “To instill fear will have no affects on people who has done everything”

    “We didn’t burn cross”

    Nice English. Don’t try to convince anyone your not a Chinese citizen. Your grammar errors give you away.

    Nice try. I didn’t major in English and I am not writing novels. Just get to the point and I don’t have time to check my grammar either. LOL

  120. specul8r

    To Physicall,

    You wrote:
    ————————————————————
    Oh yeah, I think specul8r is almost definitely related to China in some way…particularly when he said:”What I going to do is to protect and construct my country.And we’ll be stronger and stronger.”

    Any ideas about what country he’s talking about?

    And then he says this:”For your information, I am not Chinese citizens and never been a member of CCP. :)” which is contradicting his previous statement.
    ————————————————————
    I didn’t write that first paragraph. I put a reference to the source at the beginning and you didn’t catch it. I will put it again here:
    source: http://www.anti-cnn.com/forum/en/thread-1904-1-1.html

    I am not a Chinese citizen and I am a proud Chinese American. 🙂

  121. specul8r

    Another proof why falun gone is “self promoting cult”

    Udumbara flower hoax news from falun gone media:

    1) images: notice the images are posted from falun gone websites
    http://images.google.com/images?q=udumbara%20flower%20falun%20gong&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rls=DVFA,DVFA:1970–2,DVFA:en&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi

    2) video: NTDTV’s Asia Brief broadcast about udumbara flower appearance and returning of a second buddha (meaning LHZ) to save mankind – what a propaganda

    3) udumbara flower found in Sindey
    http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/9/2/89172.html

    4) udumbara flower found in California
    http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/8/18/88700.html

    ___________________________________

    WHY ALL THESE ARE HOAX AND THE PROPAGANDA

    1) IMAGES: LACEWING EGGS
    http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=lacewing+egg&spell=1
    COMPARE THE IMAGES FROM THIS LINK WITH THE IAMGE LINK FROM ABOVE AND SEE FOR YOURSELF

    2) Flowers Growing on Steel? I Beg to Differ…
    http://urbanlegends.about.com/b/2007/06/20/flowers-grow-on-steel-pipe-in-china.htm

    NOW YOU BELIEVE FALUN GONE IS A “SELF PROMOTING CULT” AND TRYING TO CHEAT ON MANY INNOCENT PEOPLE TO MAKE BELIEVE LHZ IS ‘NEW BUDDHA RETURNING TO SAVE THE MANKIND’ PROPAGANDA.

  122. physicall

    Oh. My bad, specul8r.

    BTW, I am actually a Chinese-Canadian as well.

  123. physicall

    Well, I was right in guessing that you were in some way related to China, anyway.

  124. specul8r

    To John,

    It’s still going to divide us all because not everyone believes in God (or Allah or Buddha or whoever the next prophet) of what you mention in your post.

    For anyone who has an open mind, just go to your library and check out the book – “On Fear” by J. Krishnamurti.
    http://www.amazon.com/Fear-Jiddu-Krishnamurti/dp/0062510142/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212277842&sr=8-5

    He is a great Theosophist and a great spiritual teacher.

  125. specul8r

    why “falun gone is a cult”

    Here’s the proof why falun gone is “self promoting cult” by watching these falun gone propaganda websites and sites that refute the images are hoax

    Falun Gone propaganda websites:
    1) Images (google search – udumbara flower + falun gong)
    http://images.google.com/images?q=udumbara%20flower%20falun%20gong&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rls=DVFA,DVFA:1970–2,DVFA:en&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi

    2) udumbara flower found in Australia (clearwisdom.net)
    http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/9/2/89172.html

    3) udumbara flower found in California (clearwisdom.net)
    http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/8/18/88700.html

    4) udumbara video broadcast from NTDTV to promote another Buddha (meaning LHZ) returning to save mankind

    ___________________________________

    ARE YOU READY? COMPARE IMAGES FROM LACEWING WITH UDUMBARA FLOWER AND SEE FOR YOURSELF. READ 2 FOR EXPLANATION.

    1) IMAGES OF LACEWING EGG (GOOGLE SEARCH)
    http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=lacewing+egg&spell=1

    2) FLOWERS GROWING ON STEEL? I BEG TO DIFFER…
    http://urbanlegends.about.com/b/2007/06/20/flowers-grow-on-steel-pipe-in-china.htm

    ___________________________________

    Do you see now why falun gone has been telling the truth? They lied and cheated their members to make LHZ appears larger than life, a new BUDDHA returning to the world to save mankind. Yeah… right.

  126. john

    Fear is what keeps one from really knowing the value of life as they will not venture into an unknown realm. All the great expeditions and discoveries were made by people who had fears but went beyond what they knew. They had a “vision” of something worthwhile over the horizon. In other words, they had faith even when facing the unknown and in the midst of doubters, scoffers, naysayers and religion.
    Death is the one aspect of this life on this planet every person will face and most fear it and dread it so passionately. Death is common to all of us. I, however, am not afraid of it because of my faith. I am supremely confident of where my spirit will reside when all is said and done after my physical body has ceased to function. I don’t have to worry if paradise runs out of virgins, if I will come back as a cockroach or a rat or as a small child mistaken as the umpteenth Lama. The Truth dispels darkness and fear.
    I, too, was not a believer and blasphemed just about everything which had to do with religion, didn’t matter who’s or what brand it was, or of righteousness. I tried drugs, liquor and sex as a means of looking for completeness and a reason for existing in a meaningless world. My family was disfunctional and alcoholic. Love was a word never spoken, kindness, respect or affection was never shown.
    Out of sheer desperation, and because I was afraid of botching a suicide attempt, and not really knowing it but doing what Scripture says, cried out and said, “If there is a God, show me!” No religion or swami or false prophet involved, just me and my pain and fears, and of course, a mighty and awesome God who heard and answered a man who thought there was no purpose for any of the nonsense going on in this confused world.
    I was literally sick and tired of being sick and tired of the same old routine of living. Money or any of this world’s trappings disolved any of the fears and doubts of my personal life. Anyway, God heard and answered. He uses men and women who were at one time in the “dark” but were reborn into the Light of God’s Truth, His Son, Christ. God is interested in me, and you too. All you have to do is call, won’t cost you a thing, it’s already been paid for from before the world began, even before Krishnamurti and all the rest combined.
    What’s stopping you? Fear perhaps? Step into the Light, there’s nothing hiding there to harm you.

  127. physicall

    To John:

    You didn’t really answer specul8r’s question when he said: “It’s still going to divide us all because not everyone believes in God (or Allah or Buddha or whoever the next prophet) of what you mention in your post.”

    And he does have a point. Sure, if everybody were Christians it would be a lot easier to create a true global community although it would be still be very difficult.

    But since a lot of people don’t believe in God, these would be eternal differences between the different peoples. This differences will eventually open up and instigate conflict.

  128. specul8r

    John,

    Good for you. 🙂

  129. john

    Physicall & Specul8r,
    Specul8r didn’t pose a question. He made a statement.
    Anyway, again you are right, not everyone believes in God per se. They do, however, worship something, even if they are not aware of doing so.
    Whatever takes first place in one’s life, be it an object, a goal, a person or a philosophy, is an “idol” and is “master” of their life. For we will be subservient to whatever controls our emotions, thoughts and, eventually our ultimate destiny. Pornography is a prime example, as is the violent games our youth play and, sadly, sometimes act out in real life. So many teen suicides are a direct result of these so called games they “log” onto and someone can gauge their reactions on the other end and control their follow-up reactions by changing the game, tempo, etc..
    What do they worship? Surely it is not God, the Creator. It is the god of confusion, dispondency and death. The same old enemy, but with a different face.
    Everyone has the free will, granted by God, to chose whomever they wish to believe in or worship. Just because they don’t believe doesn’t change a thing. It is in the choices we make that determines our present and future existence.
    My only desire, God is my witness, believe me or not, is that “someone” on this blog will respond, not to me, for I am no one of consequence, but to what I have been told to write. I know in my heart and spirit someone has been touched by God’s Spirit through my words.
    I may be contacted at:
    jastahley2006@yahoo.com.
    Please don’t hesitate, be ashamed or shy. I am always available for whoever is hurting, (I do work at a regular job so I am not bound to my laptop as many seem to be), confused or just wants to unload a burden. God does not waste hurts or tears. He can use them to heal someone with similar problems. He can and wants to use you, too.
    Don’t worry, I will not solicit anything from you. I want nothing from anyone, now or in the future.
    In His Service, John

  130. JennX

    Sorry peeps…I have seen how FG shows their “compassion”. They show no sympathies to anyone but their own followers and continue to beat the political drum, whilst diguising it as a ‘peaceful practice’…perhaps it began that way, but now it is a fully oiled political machine who’s only care is to promote their own version of truth to the world.

    I have lost family and friends to this ‘peaceful practice’ and now it is truly painful to see that my own instincts over this cult have come to light.

    Yes, the CCP is corrupt and yes, they seem to be especially targeting those followers of FG, however do not be fooled by the ‘innocence’ of those who practice. They have their own agenda, and the little ‘parade’ is only a small glimpse into the ugly emptiness of their souls.

  131. Casey

    Dafa practicioners = Pod people

  132. simon1749

    To John,
    There will be still conflicts in a Christian world. Just think about what happened during the medieval times, christians lived in Eroupe were more brutal to others than elsewhere in the world.

  133. Casey

    It’s not a ‘religion’ thing, it’s a ‘control’ thing.

  134. pug_ster

    Jennifer

    For what most believed that China is an atheist nation, there’s more than 110 million Christians there. You never hear Christians complain about the CCP suppressing them, no?

  135. KingKong

    For your information from wikipedia.org:

    In December 2005, Quebec Superior Court Justice Jeannine Rousseau wrote in a decision for a civil defamation case brought against Les Presses Chinoises by 232 Falun Gong practitioners. The court stated that there was insufficient evidence that the journal had defamed the practitioners. In paragraph 39 of her judgement, she stated that Falun Gong’s teachings includes rejection of science and promise of supernatural powers. In paragraph 40, she added that Falun Gong was a controversial movement which does not accept criticism.

  136. KingKong

    I believe Quebec Superior Court Justice Jeannine Rousseau is right about FLG, “which does not accept criticism”. Court action is one of the response.

  137. specul8r

    To John,

    “Everyone has the free will, granted by God, to chose whomever they wish to believe in or worship. Just because they don’t believe doesn’t change a thing. It is in the choices we make that determines our present and future existence.”

    You may call it God but others may call “Buddha Nature” or “sunyata” and some others will call it “Lord Shiva” or “Lord Krishna” or whatever they believe in. There is no point to argue what it is because there is no word to describe when you are in deep meditation with ‘GXD’ as I may name it. What is important is to be able to tolerate other religions that help others when they are suffering and expose any phony religions. I don’t have a fear of accepting your God and you didn’t even understand what is in Krishnamurti’s message in his book “on fear”. Instead, you are trying to write of what you believe about ‘fear’.

    “Fear is what keeps one from really knowing the value of life as they will not venture into an unknown realm.”

    This is what Krishnamurti said. ‘fear’ of unknown make you ‘frozen’ and that’s the conflict within you because you are empty inside and you need to fill with something. So, you fill with pleasure, drug, sex, and that still won’t make the emptiness go away. You actually depend on them as attachment. All the fear is a projection of your thought and then you have another thought projection called ‘God’ to counter fear. Still, that’s trick of your thought. Unless you understand how thought create fear, you will never fill your emptiness. That’s why Buddhism and Yogi do meditation to let go of thought to reach to the subtle state and see the light and vibration of the energy within you.

    “My only desire, God is my witness, believe me or not, is that “someone” on this blog will respond, not to me, for I am no one of consequence, but to what I have been told to write. I know in my heart and spirit someone has been touched by God’s Spirit through my words.”

    God bless you.

  138. john

    Specul8tr,
    I have no trouble whatsoever about doubts in my mind. I know where and what the battle is about.
    Although I live in a carnal world my weapons are not carnal.
    God’s Word says we are “to pull into captivity every thought and imagination which exalts itself over the knowledge and obedience of Christ”.
    (2 Corinthians 10:3-5)
    I do meditate. I meditate on God’s Word. His Word tells me exactly what I need, when I need it and for any crisis, at any time. I no longer need a “fix” of drugs, drink or sex to fill an emptiness in my life. Christ is the answer to all of mankind’s troubles.
    The problem lies within the individual and the choice of believing who Christ said He was or not.
    Religions would have you to believe that “I am O.K., you’re O.K.” , when in fact, man is “lost” and there is nothing he can do, on his on behalf or goodness, that will bring him to have eternal peace with God. There is “only one way” to know peace and be able to discern the truth about “religion” per se. That way is by accepting Jesus Christ as your personal Savior.
    I am not critical of anyone trying to find their way in this so often confusing and conflict filled life. God knows I stumbled around in the dark for 37 years, trying just about every remedy known to man, and all I got was disappointment and more confused with no rational purpose for living. But, and this is a big but, God’s Word (Romans 10:13) states, “that all who call on the name of the Lord will be saved”. Now, I didn’t know this was written, I didn’t need to, God knew, and He heard the desperate cry in the darkness of my heart and He responded with His grace, and used a Christian to explain the need for all of mankind to accept Christ for eternal salvation and the removal of the scales which blind us to the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
    I was surprised and amazed that the thing (the Gospel) which I had disparaged all my life, was in fact, factual and effective in turning my life into a miracle.
    I have been used of God to have His healing powers flow through me whereby a whole hospital full of patients with cancer, heart disease, severe burns, etc, etc, have been completely healed . Now this was not on my own accord, to do good, but I heard God tell me to go. This was not a mind thing, it was an actual experience with many amazed witnesses.
    How wonderful it is to be able to help your fellowman with power unspeakable and so glorious. The greatest thing about it was, it was not me that did it or had to take responsibilty if something had gone wrong. God did it, God did it through me because I was obedient, in faith, to His Word, and I was allowed to watch Him work.
    Now that, my friend, beats whatever else may be called religion in this lost and damned world because of an enemy which leads people to follow swamis, Lama,s, FLG, Krishna, and the never ending list of confusion and traps.
    Now, if someone can come up with something more glorious or liberating than what Christ died and paid for you and me, just bring it on. But in my heart, spirit and soul I know absolutely you won’t find it, no matter what anyone claims.

    May God’s grace and love, in the mighty name of Jesus Christ ,reach into the darkness of your heart and mind and reveal Himself to all who read this.

  139. jntikitembo

    Falun gong is a trash cult that misinforms the public. Spare yourselve from typing thoughtful responses to them, as they don’t deserve it. It’s like having a conversation with a broken record player.

  140. john

    Pug ster,
    You are right about there being many Christians in China. They are a very brave and faithful people. We Christians in the US should be as brave as they are. May God bless my brothers and sisters in China mightly!
    The fact you do not hear them complain is because of the already repressive state in which they live. They don’t wish to antagonize the officials unduly. The other fact is quite obvious as why they have to meet to worship and study in private cell groups /homes. They are discouraged by the officials from meeting in public. (Satan doesn’t like too many of God’s kids getting in his way of destruction.)
    You may not be aware of it, the media never tells the truth about atrocities done to born again believers, they instead use words like, “religious differences”, but in China they have been killed, crucified and tortured.
    In Algeria they are kidnapped and the girls and woman are sold into slavery. Yes, today!!! A christian can be legally killed in some parts of the world and if a Muslim were to be converted they can be put to death.
    Now tell me, if you can, doesn’t it seem odd that the name Jesus Christ and His message of love and peace can cause so much fear in governments and religions? It boggles one’s mind that the mere mention of a name can stir up anger and resentment, and let’s be truthful, FEAR.
    Satan has been defeated and he doesn’t want anyone to know it. He himself will one day bow his knees, ever so reluctantly, and say, “Jesus Christ is Lord of heaven and earth”, along with every human being who has ever lived on this planet.
    No one will be able to offer an excuse as to why they didn’t heed God’s message and His Messiah, His Son Christ, for the Word has gone throughout the world and He has promised when this happens His people will be taken out of it, just as in the days of Noah. The signs are very clear to those who accept Christ. All the rest are doomed to suffer.

  141. physicall

    To john,

    I’m a bit curious…what do you think about Benny Hinn?

  142. Pug

    John,

    http://video.on.nytimes.com/?fr_story=58192e42f610146c22418917109f6e4cd1c854a5

    I assume that you haven’t been to China lately and seen if Christians are cracked down as you described. Granted the places of worship in China are more spartan compared to the Churches in the US. The only time when these Christians are cracked down if they start cult like activities like the Falun Gong or if they decide to protest against the Chinese government.

  143. Ren

    they are totally a cult seriously….i dont see how tats not a cult.
    1. they burn themselves to death to “go to heaven”
    2. they kill their family members to take them to “heaven” too
    3. they cut open their own stomachs try to find the “wheel of life”
    4. Li hongzhi the MASTER is now buying houses with the money he tricked from his “students”
    those bastards deserve to get cursed at

  144. Ren

    and john, actually…. chinese people and government really DONT give a shit bout what the individual beliefs are. seriously, there are ALOT of churches in china and u can go in it whenever the hell you want. BUT in china, we truly believe in “church and government must be seperated”, SO chinese government does not accept catholism because the POPE did not agree with the chinese government. okey? if you are religious, fine. dun fuck with politics. simple as that

  145. specul8r

    John,

    What do you think of 700 Club and Pat Robertson?

  146. Not everybody in the west is dumb. People know exactly what Falun Gong (FLG) means to them.
    A few quotes:
    “a religion of lies”
    “disguises itself as exercise classes”
    “These exercises are the actual religious ritual”
    Check out the web site to see more for yourself.

    I should also point out that not every FLGer is the die hard fan of their Master(God) Li Hongzhi. Someone could be simply curious about the practice. When FLG is condemned, these people obviously will feel being attacked too. Wish there’s a better way to handle that.

    Thanks for your attention.

  147. specul8r

    that url is full of crap.

    You have no clue of what other eastern religions are and blind faith of Christian is as bad as those who believe in false religion. Have you read Lost Years of Jesus?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_years_of_Jesus

  148. mAGezEr0

    falun gong is an asshole.
    falun gong is a sucker.
    falun gong is a noob.
    falun gong is a pain in everybodies head.
    falun gong is a faggard.

  149. mAGezEr0

    falun gong should be one of the victim’s dad so he can feel the pain.

  150. I know very little about religion. The two links that you presented are a bit overwhelmed. The best I have is from http://www.religioustolerance.org/

    However, the accusations listed on that particular web page seem credible. It has the information that I couldn’t find anywhere else on the web. For example, Falun Gong practitioners make new converts by bait and switch, which is illegal by law and condemned by all Better Business Bureau’s.
    These accusations lead to a broader understanding of FLG, which is the focal point here.

  151. I’ve read that a some people has fall victim of FLG. These people should file class action lawsuit against it. However, I haven’t read anything about legal action.

    I’ve also read that some of the victims are actually family members of FLG. Then, somebody should call social workers for help. The problem will be always there unless it is resolved. One way or the other.

  152. Ren

    seriously do you not understand why chinese people in flushing are so furious with the FLG? those falungong members have been in flushing for years, and no one gave a shit bout them. But they celebrated the earthquake, a disaster that THEIR own people have died in. how inhumane is that? even monkeys cry when they see their own members die, these FLG members are worse than even animals! the false pictures and quotes they have printed out are absolutely embarassing chinese people. FLG is an embarassment of china as well as chinese communities overseas.

  153. I certainly understand the reason. From the information I can gather from the internet, the whole thing was initiated by Falun Gong’s interruption of the Sichuan earthquake relief efforts, gloat about the tremendous lose of human of lives, and the disruption of the moan observance for the victims. In the picture posted at Falun Gong’s web site , you can see that Falun Gong personel waive their banner in front of those with banner with the Chinese character “哀” (means “moan”) in black on green background. I grew up in China. I will be extremely enraged too if somebody messes up with my “moan”.

    Another picture published at The New York Times’s web site http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/30/nyregion/falun600.jpg
    I can guess that one of the “天灭中” is for CCP. So it should reads “God destroy CCP”. However I don’t understand what the other “天灭中” for. Anybody have a good guess?

  154. From the information I can gather from the internet, the rage of the Chinese against Falun Gong was initiated by Falun Gong’s interruption of the Sichuan earthquake relief efforts, gloat about the tremendous lose of human of lives, and the disruption of the moan observance for the victims. In the picture posted at Falun Gong’s web site , you can see that Falun Gong personel waive their banner in front of those with banner with the Chinese character “哀” (means “moan”) in black on green background. I grew up in China. I will be extremely enraged too if somebody messes up with my “moan”.

    From the picture published at The New York Times http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/30/nyregion/falun600.jpg There’re two “天灭中”. I can guess that one of the “天灭中” is for CCP. Anybody knows what the other “天灭中” for?

  155. From the information I can gather from the internet, the rage of the Chinese against FLG was initiated by FLG’s interruption of the Sichuan earthquake relief efforts, gloat about the tremendous lose of human of lives, and the disruption of the moan observance for the victims. In the picture posted at Falun Gong’s web site , you can see that Falun Gong personel waive their banner in front of those with banner with the Chinese character “哀” (means “moan”) in black on green background. I grew up in China. I will be extremely enraged too if somebody messes up with my “moan”.

    From the picture published at The New York Times http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/30/nyregion/falun600.jpg There’re two “天灭中”. I can guess that one of the “天灭中” is for ???. Anybody knows what the other “天灭中” for?

  156. Ren

    天灭中can also be interpreted as god destroys china. because 中 is also short for 中国,china.

    those FLG bastards are seriously a disgrace to chinese people

  157. KingKong

    You’re right, Ren. Anybody from China would easily figure it out. The publishers at The New York Times did a very good job of cutting out the two sensitive characters “共” and “国”. Otherwise it should read “天灭中共”(God Destroy CCP), “天灭中国”(God Destroy China). So, thank you folks at The New York Times, for showing the world the anti China nature of Falun gong. No wonder Chinese in NY took to the street to protest against it, which is blind by the religion that is full of hatred. Completely lie against “Compassion”, one of the three principles of the religion.

  158. desperately wive

    Hi everyone, I am a wife of a FLGner, I warn everyone to alert to this cult!My husband is a good,nice,warm person,also a good father.But since he joined FLG,he becomes an alien!He bought FLG newspaper/Epoch times,and he will shout to me if I forget distributed it,called me as an evil agent.He spent much money to buy VCD,book,etc that support this group,insist me to join their meeting,insist my children and me to go parade,all day long,chanting,meditation,reading their book.If I ask about his master,my husband will going crazy!He believe that his master will protect him,like a God.I very suffer,try to keep patience,protect my children.We have no time together like a family,most of time he reading his FLG book.He got angry and insane if I gave medicine to my sick child,I have to find a chance to give that medicine.I pray to Jesus why this happened to my family?we married for 13 years without any hassle,but FLG ruined my family,stole my husband.he is very kind person,with good job,good education,sincerely heart.Now my children feel that their father like a monster!(if we talk about his FLG!).I still try to make him conscious and wake up,realised what is FLG true color,their agenda.Everyody out there please watchout about this group,before they stole your life,your family!

    • FalunGong is BULLshit

      too sad. this FLG group is absolutely devilish. Talk about messed up to the core. I saw a channel called new dynasty channel it is chinese people or should i even call them chinese people anymore that are completely making up lies and trying to enrage people to hate and fight the chinese government. all despicable. good luck with your propaganda infected husband.

  159. physicall

    Can you speak English?

  160. falun gong is evil

    desperately wive, one word for you: Divorce. This is the advice that I never gave out.

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  162. Chinese Australian

    Totally agree with anyone who considers FLG to be evil!

    BTW, I am a Chinese by birth which I have grown to be bery fond of, so I hope people like Jennifer are not going to denying my freedom of speech based on my ethnicity.

    People like Jennifer are the real victims of this FLG crap, by that I mean people who got brainwashed to believe that the CCP is a great force of Evil in the world.

    I did not grow up being fond of the Chinese government either, since people in China were just starting over from the aftermath of the Cultural Revolution. Due to the economical reform in the 80’s, most people in China were lured by the prosperities of the west, including me. As a juniour high schooler, I found myself marching on the streets with university students in May 1989

  163. Chinese Australian

    And I moved to Australia with my parents 3 years later. During the last 20 years living in Australia, I found higher self, did FLG for 3 months, finished uni, worked for a while, and then my defining moment of the western democracy came when the local court totally denied me the basic human rights of being treated equally under law due to the connections that my powerful opponent had. Either the government nor the media had any interest in investigating this abuse upon my complaints. And since then I have met a number of honest and innocent ordinary Australians getting abused under the legal system in the same way I was.

  164. Chinese Australian

    Anyone critises Chinese government for its ‘supposedly’ human rights abuse should first have a long and hard look at their own governments!

    There governments are guilty of human rights abuses themselves, and the political ideology of their system, in particular the seperation of powers makes these abuses undetectable and unpurnishable. Many people in the west are sufferring in silence, yet their governments are too busying themselves brainwashing their people and demonising their biggest perceived threat, namely the People’s Republic and China. They support terrorists like FLG and the HH Dalai Lama to smear the Chinese government, in view that the Chinese government would eventually breakdown, so that they could strip away its resources like they did during the colonial years.

  165. Chinese Australian

    Now back to FLG. Is it a cult? Absolutely. Budhism is never about idol worshipping, yet in FLG, this is a huge element. In addition, it prohibits its member from reading or practicing any other methods of spiritualism. 10 years ago, I quit FLG because of this. It appeared to be very controlling to me and also shows a strong lack of confidence on Li Hong Zhi’s part. And one thing I found funny was that it was said in his book that when you are advanced enough, you can read other people’s minds and they cannot read yours. Ummm did I start my spiritual journey in order to read other people’s minds? I think not. And among other stuff, I just found the teaching to be childish and shallow. And I totally agree with the other comments that if your raise any doubts about their cult or lead, wow the reactions you get from the followers, let’s just say I was really glad I did not continue to be any part of it soon after.

    So I don’t really have a problem with the Chinese government banning something so toxic. And their inconsistancy did not just stop there. About 7 years later, I had the misfortune to attend their ‘Shen Yun’ show as there was nothing on their promotional material any referenct to the FLG. The show turned out to be an insult to my artistic senses. All the friends with whom I went with were disgusted by the performance as well as the fake applauds by their supportors from the back rows. If they advocate ‘Truth, Kindness and Forebearance’, then I did not see any Truth in the way they handled their show. And from that your can quickly realise how fake their 5 star reviews are.

  166. Chinese Australian

    For anybody wanting to defend the FLG, and feel sorry for them because they ‘were horribly oppressed by the Chinese government’, I am not surprised as your governments had spent much of your tax money on brainwashing your than to promote you and your family’s wellbeing and prosperity. I live in the west, if it was not for my own experience, I would just be like the rest of people around me refusing to disbelieve anything our governments do not tell them. To find our own truth, we all have our own lessons to learn, but what kind of truth will one learn from supporting the FLG? And at what expense? Whatever you need to learn, learn it well and move on.

  167. Chinese Australian

    BTW, I see nothing ‘Truthful, Kind or Forebearant’ in FLG, only fear and hatred inducing and mind controling political tactics for evil motives.

    Anyone wanting to accuse me of being CCP, read carefully:
    – I really don’t mind being called CCP, but unfortunately I am not.
    – discounting my credibilty just because of me being supportive of the CCP and against the FLG only proves you being brain-washed not me.

  168. Chinese Australian

    Thanks for the news, I saw it on the Australian news too. I wished I was there too, it was time for the FLGers to know what kind of scum they were. I really don’t like what they do to themselves and to others. At least in Australia, I never forego a chance to tell them do some better with themselves whenever I could. They are tools in the truest sense.

  169. Chinese Australian

    The earthquake really brought out the best in people. Everyone was moved to tears and most generous to share their care and support for the affected. There was so much love here in the Chinese community here in Australia. And considering the sheer amount of love generated by billions of people all over the world, I would hardly regard it a karmic payback, but a blessing in disguise.

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  174. Falun Gong sucks. How can they be celebrating when they are watching their own fellow Chinese people die? Falun Gong sucks!

  175. Li hongzhi claims a lot of things he claims he can heal with his hands and put a Fa-Lun A SPINNING LAW WHEEL on the lower abdomen and no medications just qigong exercise can heal them. a practitioner claims his husband was cured by Falun Gong exercises. REALLY???

  176. SHEN YUN PERFORMING ARTS THIS HOW LI HONGZHI GETS MONEY FROM TO AGAINST CHINA.FALUN GONG ARE CULTS FLG USED FAKE PHOTOS AND VIDEOS TO BRAINWASHED PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD AND ON THE STREETS WITH FAKE PETTITIONS FOR AGAINST ORGAN HARVERSTING AND TORTURES THE PETITIONS DOESN’T GO TO YOUR GOVERNMENT IT’S A PAY ROLL FOR FALUN GONG PETITION THEY SAY GO TO GOVERNMENT THIS HAPPENS A LONG TIME AND NOTHING HAPPEN?
    FALUN GONG PRACTITIONERS IS AS FAKE AS KONY 2012.

  177. FALUN GONG COULDN’T TELL THE TRUTH ABOUT SELF-IMMOLATIONS IN JAN 23,2001 THEY SAID CCP SELF-IMMOLATED MADE NO SESE. FLG HAD GO ON HUNGER STRIKES SKINNY FLG DID IT THEMSELVES.FALUN DAFA DID HUNGER STRIKE WHEN THEY ARE NOT ARRESTED SIT IN OUTSIDE WEARING A BANNER SAID HUNGER STRIKE.

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